Dude..you gotta get those readings down, this is what's causing the laboured breathing.
Can you get hold of some Bio-Spira? It's quite pricy, but is pretty much guaranteed to cycle your tank pronto.
Puffs are very sensitive to these toxins, so get busy with the water changes ... keep us posted.
Pami.
itchy figure eight
Forum rules
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
itchy figure eight
Thanks so much to everyone.
When I purchased my F8, all of my readings were ok - I think the initial high numbers were due to, as now I'm seeing, overstocking and overfeeding. I felt SO bad when I went to take a new reading about two days after putting my F8 and cats in there and I saw how outrageous my numbers were. I knew my tank had correctly cycled, but didn't realize the bio load would cause a second cycle of such great trouble! I don't have any plecos (my fault, my spelling is awful) I have two pictus cats, however I'm sure it is still going to be considering overstocking
I'll start on my tank right now getting things situated as Eric suggested. I will also make sure I get my green spot into a bigger tank - I was planning on getting a larger tank sometime soon - I'll just push that time line up. Again thank you so much for all of your help - I'll let you know how things go over the next few days.
When I purchased my F8, all of my readings were ok - I think the initial high numbers were due to, as now I'm seeing, overstocking and overfeeding. I felt SO bad when I went to take a new reading about two days after putting my F8 and cats in there and I saw how outrageous my numbers were. I knew my tank had correctly cycled, but didn't realize the bio load would cause a second cycle of such great trouble! I don't have any plecos (my fault, my spelling is awful) I have two pictus cats, however I'm sure it is still going to be considering overstocking
I'll start on my tank right now getting things situated as Eric suggested. I will also make sure I get my green spot into a bigger tank - I was planning on getting a larger tank sometime soon - I'll just push that time line up. Again thank you so much for all of your help - I'll let you know how things go over the next few days.
Thanks so much!
Candy Short
Candy Short
i had the same prob at first, as the sudden increase of bioload from (as it was then) three F8s caused a big spike.
One thing to consider is old food collecting under rocks etc and going off in the water, so make sure you lift ornaments and vacuum under them - that can be a major source of pollution.
Pami.
One thing to consider is old food collecting under rocks etc and going off in the water, so make sure you lift ornaments and vacuum under them - that can be a major source of pollution.
Pami.
biospira
If you think bio-spira will work, I'm on it! I'll have my husband pick it up on the way home from work. I have CYCLE from Nutrafin and Stress Zyme from Aquarium Pharma. Will eaither of those help? Do you think the protien skimmer is ok to run - I noticed it took out alot of junk from the tank.
Thanks so much!
Candy Short
Candy Short
Re: biospira
Both of those products do hardly anything for your tank!! Bio-Spira is the only good stuff.subby wrote:If you think bio-spira will work, I'm on it! I'll have my husband pick it up on the way home from work. I have CYCLE from Nutrafin and Stress Zyme from Aquarium Pharma. Will eaither of those help? Do you think the protien skimmer is ok to run - I noticed it took out alot of junk from the tank.
Forget Stress Zyme and Cycle. Have you been adding them already?
They could account for the sky high readings that have by some miracle not proved fatal. The two products are JUNK, add bioload and give you wacky readings. When i read 6ppm for NH3 I wondered if you'd been using that junk, cos that's a lethal reading, but you can get screwy readings when you're adding stuff like that.
Don't put any more in, and get the Bio-Spira.
You may not even need it - try a couple of hefty water changes and see if the dodgy levels drop - if not, get the BS and you should be away.
Let us know.
Pami.
They could account for the sky high readings that have by some miracle not proved fatal. The two products are JUNK, add bioload and give you wacky readings. When i read 6ppm for NH3 I wondered if you'd been using that junk, cos that's a lethal reading, but you can get screwy readings when you're adding stuff like that.
Don't put any more in, and get the Bio-Spira.
You may not even need it - try a couple of hefty water changes and see if the dodgy levels drop - if not, get the BS and you should be away.
Let us know.
Pami.
Dear Pami,
I have been using both Cycle and Stress Zyme - like mad! I wondered if that was the case. oh phoey! (I can use phoey on the screen, right?
I just did a 25% water change in the midst if talking with all of you, so I guess I'm on my way to semi cleaning my poor little ones up! Before I add anything elce, I want to run them my all of you, if thats ok. (I tend to want to medicate to make everything "better" - isn't that what moms do? Unfortunately, I want to help to much and end up over doing it.) What about Bio-Coat for stress or Stress Guard? I've used both and my F8 seemed to respond to the stress guard the best..... do you recommend any product over another to take some of the "stress" out? Is all the bubbles from the protien skimmer oK? I can't all of you enough for you help. I REALLY appreciate it. It's hard to get help with these little guys, and when the fish store tells you that these fish are "hardy" and to just leave them alone that they will adjust - well .. did any of you want to just jump up and strangle that sales clerK? yeah, me too!
I have been using both Cycle and Stress Zyme - like mad! I wondered if that was the case. oh phoey! (I can use phoey on the screen, right?
I just did a 25% water change in the midst if talking with all of you, so I guess I'm on my way to semi cleaning my poor little ones up! Before I add anything elce, I want to run them my all of you, if thats ok. (I tend to want to medicate to make everything "better" - isn't that what moms do? Unfortunately, I want to help to much and end up over doing it.) What about Bio-Coat for stress or Stress Guard? I've used both and my F8 seemed to respond to the stress guard the best..... do you recommend any product over another to take some of the "stress" out? Is all the bubbles from the protien skimmer oK? I can't all of you enough for you help. I REALLY appreciate it. It's hard to get help with these little guys, and when the fish store tells you that these fish are "hardy" and to just leave them alone that they will adjust - well .. did any of you want to just jump up and strangle that sales clerK? yeah, me too!
Thanks so much!
Candy Short
Candy Short
There are some great LFS folks and some not so great! It sounds like you know where you need to head now. You're right that pictus cats would still overload the tank very quickly....but I really like them myself - beautiful fish.
I think water changes and getting rid of any ammo lock or amquel will help you out. The ammonia will go down with simple water changes being sure to vacuum the gravel like Pamela said.
We've all gone through similar things which is why many of us now advocate understocking your tank! Also, both the GSP and Figure 8 sound like they're large enough for every other day feedings which will help keep your tank cleaner.
One other question...what filter other than the protein skimmer are you running? I'm not overly familar with them, so I'm curious what your main filter is.
Eric
I think water changes and getting rid of any ammo lock or amquel will help you out. The ammonia will go down with simple water changes being sure to vacuum the gravel like Pamela said.
We've all gone through similar things which is why many of us now advocate understocking your tank! Also, both the GSP and Figure 8 sound like they're large enough for every other day feedings which will help keep your tank cleaner.
One other question...what filter other than the protein skimmer are you running? I'm not overly familar with them, so I'm curious what your main filter is.
Eric
protien skimmer
Dear Eric,
Usually protien skimmers are for saltwater tanks, but they are finding there are benefits for brackish as well. Protien skimmers,most of the time, are units of their own, but I found one that is a protien skimmer and filter system all in one. Its called the Skilter 250 made by Skilter. I saw the filter /protien skimmer unit at my lfs for around 50.00. I then looked on line and found the same one for 35.99 at drsfostersmith.com. If you go to their web site, you can read about the unit. I have found they have a great number of items which are quite a bit less than buying them at the fish store. Unfortunately, I tend to get overwhelmed and think I need this and that when really, I don't. Anyways, the unit I purchased can filter up to a 55 gallon aquarium.
Let me know if you want more info on the skimmer. I really like it - it has filtered out quite a bit of "yucky stuff"
Usually protien skimmers are for saltwater tanks, but they are finding there are benefits for brackish as well. Protien skimmers,most of the time, are units of their own, but I found one that is a protien skimmer and filter system all in one. Its called the Skilter 250 made by Skilter. I saw the filter /protien skimmer unit at my lfs for around 50.00. I then looked on line and found the same one for 35.99 at drsfostersmith.com. If you go to their web site, you can read about the unit. I have found they have a great number of items which are quite a bit less than buying them at the fish store. Unfortunately, I tend to get overwhelmed and think I need this and that when really, I don't.
Anyways, the unit I purchased can filter up to a 55 gallon aquarium.Let me know if you want more info on the skimmer. I really like it - it has filtered out quite a bit of "yucky stuff"
Thanks so much!
Candy Short
Candy Short
-
YBeNormal
- Former Staff Member
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Folks on the SW forums don't seem to think too highly of skilters. If you are happy with it and the skilter has removed any waste from your tank at all, then it was well worth the investment. I wish I could say the same for all of the meds and other additives that you have been using...
Most diseases can be prevented and even cured by providing clean water, quality foods and proper environments for the fish. Pour the Cycle, Stress-Zyme, Bio-Guard and Stress Coat down the drain. They make owners feel like they are doing something good for their fish and the LFS happens to make a few bucks in the process. Otherwise, these additives serve no useful purpose.
The bubbles from the skimmer should not be an issue as long as they are not overwhelming the tank and the fish have some calm areas in the tank to use as resting spots. Water changes should be your #1 priority right now, along with getting a cycled tank or two ready (Bio-Spira would be a great idea for this) so you can split up the fish that you currently own. You might also want to consider purchasing a test kit that uses liquid drops instead of test strips. Test strips often give readings that are far from accurate.
Most diseases can be prevented and even cured by providing clean water, quality foods and proper environments for the fish. Pour the Cycle, Stress-Zyme, Bio-Guard and Stress Coat down the drain. They make owners feel like they are doing something good for their fish and the LFS happens to make a few bucks in the process. Otherwise, these additives serve no useful purpose.
The bubbles from the skimmer should not be an issue as long as they are not overwhelming the tank and the fish have some calm areas in the tank to use as resting spots. Water changes should be your #1 priority right now, along with getting a cycled tank or two ready (Bio-Spira would be a great idea for this) so you can split up the fish that you currently own. You might also want to consider purchasing a test kit that uses liquid drops instead of test strips. Test strips often give readings that are far from accurate.
Get that ammonia down to nothing and you should have no problem. Do a water change once a week until the ammonia goes down. If your puffer looks like he is breathing heavy make sure you have an air pump and if you do mabey try putting an extra in it. what kind of filter are you using for what size tank. How many gph does the filter pump. Get that ammonia down and you should be ok.
stephen
stephen
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Pufferpunk
- Queen Admin
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Listen to Jayhawk & get those fish situated, by seperating the FW & BW fish & then plan for a larger tank for the GSP.
You can instantly cycle a tank w/Bio-Spira. This will also help a tank that has crashed, as yours seems to be. If it were my tank, I'd be doing daily (or even 2x/day), 80% water changes, to keep if from becoming toxic. Are you cleaning the gravel, under & between ornaments, plants, etc? Make sure if any ornaments are hollow, to take them completely out of the water when cleaning under them, so the water inside doesn't get stagnant. Did maybe a snail or anything else die in there?
You can instantly cycle a tank w/Bio-Spira. This will also help a tank that has crashed, as yours seems to be. If it were my tank, I'd be doing daily (or even 2x/day), 80% water changes, to keep if from becoming toxic. Are you cleaning the gravel, under & between ornaments, plants, etc? Make sure if any ornaments are hollow, to take them completely out of the water when cleaning under them, so the water inside doesn't get stagnant. Did maybe a snail or anything else die in there?
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
Hi to everyone,
I have great news! I did a 45% water change yesterday (I was unable to get on the computer yesterday, so I couldn't read the additional wonderful ideas).Thie morning both my f8 and my gsp look AWSOME! They are so peaceful in the tank now - not lethargic, just happy swimming and playing. They are the only two in there - and guess what? NO itching!!!!
The other fish are temporally in my small snail tank, but it has good water quality and is heated - they seem fine this morning, but I will keep and eye on them. They already have a new home - a 90 gallon tank (someone in our family has a great size tank and said they would take them).
My readings on the ammnoia have gone down by 50% !! Now that I think about it, I did have a small upside - down catfish that turned up missing. It's quite possible he died inside one of the ornaments.... that would make sense out of this whole matter. When I cleaned the tank yesterday, I took out everything and scrubbed the crap out of them! I vaccumed my tank as well while I was doing the water changes.
You have all been wonderful! Now thanks to your help I have happy puffs and as I continue the steps to completely get it ammnoia free, they will get happier and happier! I will keep you posted.
I have great news! I did a 45% water change yesterday (I was unable to get on the computer yesterday, so I couldn't read the additional wonderful ideas).Thie morning both my f8 and my gsp look AWSOME! They are so peaceful in the tank now - not lethargic, just happy swimming and playing. They are the only two in there - and guess what? NO itching!!!!
The other fish are temporally in my small snail tank, but it has good water quality and is heated - they seem fine this morning, but I will keep and eye on them. They already have a new home - a 90 gallon tank (someone in our family has a great size tank and said they would take them).
My readings on the ammnoia have gone down by 50% !! Now that I think about it, I did have a small upside - down catfish that turned up missing. It's quite possible he died inside one of the ornaments.... that would make sense out of this whole matter. When I cleaned the tank yesterday, I took out everything and scrubbed the crap out of them! I vaccumed my tank as well while I was doing the water changes.
You have all been wonderful! Now thanks to your help I have happy puffs and as I continue the steps to completely get it ammnoia free, they will get happier and happier! I will keep you posted.
Thanks so much!
Candy Short
Candy Short
Big Al's online.
Oooh...listen to me...I've never been within 1000 miles of the stuff.
If you've been putting a load of Stress Coat in, then your results are gonna be way out of whack.
Looks like water change city for a while, but it seems that we've identified where you're going wrong, and I think you'll get it sorted soon.
Pami.
Oooh...listen to me...I've never been within 1000 miles of the stuff.
If you've been putting a load of Stress Coat in, then your results are gonna be way out of whack.
Looks like water change city for a while, but it seems that we've identified where you're going wrong, and I think you'll get it sorted soon.
Pami.