My crazed GSP dwarf needs help!

[foxx1]

Hi there,

I recently purchased 3 little GSP (dwarf), neither of them seem to be eating. I am trying to feed it blood warms but they just ignore it even when it drops on their heads. I have little snails all over the tank -but I've never seen them eat them. One particular puffer has been acting funny -he swims in twirls upwards and has very bad balance. He even just rests on his back at the bottom of the tank when he can't get up. He is "breathing" heavily too. I assume that he is a he because of his yellowish belly -but now he is developing more brown around his mouth. He use to go up for air a lot, and now he just sits at the bottom... I've placed him in another tank by himself.

The female puffer seems healthy, she mostly just sleeps on top of a leaf. The other one I think is also a male but much smaller. They do not fight each other and are now spread throughout the tank instead of swimming together like they use to. (I've only had them for a few days)

Tank: 25 Gallon slightly salted
Water: recently tested and is good, except a little on the hard side (don't know how to fix)
Ornaments: gravel, rocks, greek pillar, bubble releasing treasure chest, bendy bubble releaser
Plants: 5 different plants spread throughout tank
Fish: 3 small bottom feeders (not the cat fish, the one that starts with an "o"...)

[foxx1]

How long has the tank been set up? 1.5 week
Did you cycle the tank? How? friend gave me his tank with some of the water (catfish previously lived in it) i added more water and used chemicals to get rid of chlorine, used the "cycle" solution, and used the bio-ridder solution. Also, I have a filter that was running on max before I bought the GSPs.
How long have you had the fish? 1 week
How big is the tank? 25 Gallons
How big is the fish? 1/2"
Any tankmates? 3 otocinclus (one of them very fat) roughly 1.5"
Are you doing weekly water changes? How much? have not started yet
What are the water parameters: 26 degree C
Ammonia? (should be 0 at all times) 0.3
NitrItes? (should be 0 at all times) 0.6
NitrAtes? (should be <20, or even better, <10) do not know
pH? 7.5-8
How long have you been keeping fish? first time...

Are you using marine salt? yes

[Puffalicious]

A GSP(green spotted puffer) and a dwarf puffer is totally different. So wwhich one do you have? check the pufferpedia and compare. If you have a GSP, it will need 30gal for ONE, you have 3 so you need 90 gallons. If you have a dwarf, then you're not suppose to put salt because they're 100% freshwater.

What is your Ammonia, Nitrate, Nitrite, PH, water temp. reading?

I'm assuming you didn't cycle the tank becuase it sounds like your puffers are suffering from ammonia poisoning....

[Boxermom]

First, Welcome.

Second, there’s no such thing as a GSP dwarf puffer. Its either a GSP or a dwarf. Can you get a picture of it? GSPs are brackish, dwarves are freshwater, so its important to find out exactly what you have.

Third, size doesn’t mean anything as far as sexing them.

Fourth, your tank not cycled depending on how long its been since he had fish in it. Please read this: http://aquariumboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26 They may be suffering from toxic water. Use Prime to detoxify the ammonia and nitrites, and try to get some Biospira. Do not buy anything else to cycle it, only Biospira works.

Otos do not like salted water and it will kill them.

[foxx1]

I will rid the tank of salt water then... depending on the puffer.

[foxx1]

Can I put Biospira while the fish are in the tank? The tank has been cycled... My friend left some of his water in it that has already been treated and things like that -What I did was add water on top of that and put in the aforementioned chemicals.


Thanks for the welcome, and the quick relies!

[Boxermom]

That is a dwarf puffer, purely freshwater, no salt should be added. Biospira can be added while fish are in the tank. Water has negligible beneficial bacteria in it, using someone's water from an established tank doesn't do anything. "Cycle" product in a bottle only adds to the bioload, not a good thing, its dead bacteria. A declorinator is all you need. I recommend Prime, which also detoxifies ammonia and nitrites so it doesn't harm the fish.

[Nick]

The chemicals, other than the dechlorinator, are useless for cycling. Biospira should always be added to a tank with fish, without some source of waste, it will die. Unfortunately your tank is not cycled, or ammonia and nitrite would read zero. Cycling means that the right bacteria live in the filter to remove ammonia and nitrite as they are produced, so they will never be measurable in a cycled tank.

[foxx1]

Just to clarify this is what I must do?

1. Change water to rid it of salt.
2. Use the dechlorinate solution to rid the water of chlorine.
3. Use Biospira to get the proper bacteria in the water and no ammonia and nitrogen.
4. Test water make sure of the following:
a) 26 degree C
b) pH level of 7.5-8
c) no ammonia or nitrogen
d) how much carbon, hardness and other?
I have the water tester dropper and test tubes, what order am I suppose to test in?
5. Anything else?

Can I do all this while the puffers and otos are in the tank? They're probably super stressed out right now to add... or maybe I should remove them so they can have a quiet and proper salt-less environment whilst I cycle the tank.

I'm really sorry about being kind of lazy to read about it, but I'm just afraid of the information circulating around on the internet -I read somewhere that dwarf puffers are actually brackish water creatures despite what people say and that it helps prevent diseases.

Anyways, thank you, I really appreciate your helps.

[Boxermom]

pH level isn't important as long as its stable. Same with hardness, etc. Stable parameters are more important than hitting a specific number with stuff like that. The ones you want to hit specific numbers on is ammonia and nitrites, which need to be zero.

Yup, you can do all of that while the fish are still in the tank. Do not remove them or it will stress them even more, and they'd still be in an uncycled tank while you are cycling their tank, no? Just do a water change to remove the salt (hopefully you haven't added much), always add declorinator with every water change/addition, and add the Biospira once to establish the biological cycle.

The whole brackish prevents illness is a myth, as is the all puffers are brackish thing. Actually very few puffers are truly brackish, most are either fully freshwater or fully saltwater.

[foxx1]

update:

The tank has been cleaned and is chlorine-less and salt-less, but I couldn't find any Biospira at the store, although what I do have is "cycle: reduces fish loss, more nitrifiers keeps aquariums healthy". Miraculously, Senior el Loco (my crazed puffer) is still alive! but he's still swimming on his back and looking dazed and moving very little... I've isolated him to one part of the tank with the net so that he doesn't get hurt or anything.... Is he going to pass soon? Is there anything I can do? We're all feeling really sad for him. Also, all of them still ignoring the blood warms.

[Pufferpunk]

"Cycle" product in a bottle only adds to the bioload, not a good thing, its dead bacteria.

[foxx1]

What about "Stress Zyme: biological filtration booster: contains dual action live bacteria"? because i bought that just in case my "cycle" doesn't do what I think it does... And if I do put this, would it be safe after having put all that other stuff in?

[foxx1]

He's huffing and puffing a lot and on his side....

[Nusquam]

If you can't get a hold of Biospira, don't buy or add anything else. Just keep changing your water. Try to change at least 20% (AT LEAST) a day until the ammonia and nitrites both reach 0. It should take a few weeks, so good luck.