Advice for initial GSP tank set up

[*GSP*Fan*]

I have been browsing and doing quite a bit of reading on this forum for a little while now after deciding on getting a GSP. I finally decided to make an account to be able to ask questions. I don't want to make any mistakes when getting everything ready for my GSP and want to do whats both best for the GSP and easiest for myself from the beginning.

I have visited my LFS and know I will be able to get a GSP without any issues. I have been researching the different setups, brackish vs full marine but am still unsure of what I want, or how I should begin. I was leaning towards full marine as I've read it can be cheaper in the long run, I believe due to the water changes/salt if I understood correctly. I am not sure exactly how this works. Could I get more of an explanation there?

I am unsure of if I wanted to do one or two GSPs. I am pretty familiar with their tank size requirements but get thrown off for full marine. I am not sure if it needs to be larger to accommodate a full marine setup, for both a single or pair of GSPs. So what is best in both cases?

Also, what do I need to efficiently setup and run a full marine tank? Do I need a skimmer, circulation pump, live rock/sand, and a filter or do the latter listed items make up for the need of a filter?

Would it be okay to place a baby/young GSP in full marine after he/she was acclimated? I was told by my LSF they were kept in brackish.

Sorry I am so full of questions I just want to get this right. I know I will need to have my tank setup and cycled, which will take some time, before I can even get my GSP(s) but I want to begin the process as soon as possible.

TIA!

[bertie 83]

If you run marine with live rock, a skimmer and preferably a refugium, you will need to do a lot less waterchanges compared to the f/w and b/w 50% per week. Thus saving salt by the tonne. 30g min per gsp but more is now recommended, 75g for a pair would be sufficient but as ever more is certainly better. Start off with a tank with a sump whatever you decide as it is useful for hiding equipment and definately essential for marine should you choose that route. Keep us posted with your decisions and by all means create a tank building thread so we can see your progress. Remember the importance of a proper fishless cycle before purchasing your puffer friend. Once again welcome

[*GSP*Fan*]

If you run marine with live rock, a skimmer and preferably a refugium, you will need to do a lot less waterchanges compared to the f/w and b/w 50% per week. Thus saving salt by the tonne. 30g min per gsp but more is now recommended, 75g for a pair would be sufficient but as ever more is certainly better. Start off with a tank with a sump whatever you decide as it is useful for hiding equipment and definately essential for marine should you choose that route. Keep us posted with your decisions and by all means create a tank building thread so we can see your progress. Remember the importance of a proper fishless cycle before purchasing your puffer friend. Once again welcome

Thanks again!

I keep reading its cheaper in the long run but do kinda worry about the upfront costs, especially with live rock. Could I start out with just so much live rock and base (I believe it is called) ? Does that take a while before the tank could be properly filtered that way and is there a filter of some sort I could use if needed to begin with before I only have live rock, if that makes sense.

I have never had a marine/saltwater setup of any sort before so am slowly learning. I just want to make sure I have everything that is needed and that it is set up properly to function properly. I can't get anything in the library to work or any searches to work. Is there somewhere that describes more in detail about starting up a full marine tank, what the salinity is to be consider full marine, for live rock to thrive, etc. I am trying to find out all of this by reading, mostly from this forum, but it kinda seems a little overwhelming with it all being so new.

Also, would a 29 gallon (or so) be too small to successfully set it up as full marine?

My boyfriend spoke with an employee at one of our LFS and he mentioned having tanks of his own for sale, one being a 29 gallon with stand and accessories for only $65. Which is about 1/3 of the price it would be new. I have not seen it yet and do not know the dimensions but should know more on Monday.

ETA: I have been reading about the cycling as well and definitely wanted to do a fishless cycle. Now that I believe I want to go full marine I am not sure how that may differ. I had intended on purchasing plain ammonia and this

http://www.amazon.com/Instant-Ocean-779 ... ords=start

[bertie 83]

29g with displacement would be too small for even 1 gsp. You can mix live rock and base rock, it will take some time for the live rock to seed the base rock tho. Salinity is not my strong point but I believe 1.020 - 1.024 is perfect for live rock. I could be slightly off on that tho. Unfortunately our server is knackered so searches are out at the moment. Use google as your friend, or just ask any questions here and we will do our best to answer them for you.

[*GSP*Fan*]

29g with displacement would be too small for even 1 gsp. You can mix live rock and base rock, it will take some time for the live rock to seed the base rock tho. Salinity is not my strong point but I believe 1.020 - 1.024 is perfect for live rock. I could be slightly off on that tho. Unfortunately our server is knackered so searches are out at the moment. Use google as your friend, or just ask any questions here and we will do our best to answer them for you.

Google has been helping me out quite a bit as well. It has actually taken me to some topics in this forum ( I believe it was when I searched breeding snails or similar), the pages were loading enough to read but it was very...simple I guess where things are messed up.

I thought that a 29 would end up being too small. What would be minimum size for one and then two GSPS in a full marine setup?

The guy that has the 29 for sale also has a 55 and 90 gallon I believe it was. I don't know more than that though.

I'm more worried about the weight though, especially with all the live rock, than I am the actual space or anything it may take up.

Would you feel comfortable answering a few more questions regarding live rock or should I just make a separate topic?
I feel I'm going a bit overboard since I just joined, I just want to get things up and running asap.

[PufferMe!]

I started my single GSP in a 28 gallon, with the lfs store saying "it will be a long time till you need to upgrade". I disagree, and after only a few months, have bought a 68 gallon for him, which I'm currently cycling. I've heard that live rock has a broad range that it will survive in from 1.017-1.024+. I've got my tank at 1.20 and have coral, feather dusters on the rock, which are very cool, but I don't expect to survive once I put the GSP in the tank, sadly. With one GSP I'm hoping I don't need a protein skimmer (time will tell), but with live rock you'll want a good water circulation pump. With one in a good size tank, you may be able to get away without too much equipment - but I'm still learning too

Gwen

[*GSP*Fan*]

I started my single GSP in a 28 gallon, with the lfs store saying "it will be a long time till you need to upgrade". I disagree, and after only a few months, have bought a 68 gallon for him, which I'm currently cycling. I've heard that live rock has a broad range that it will survive in from 1.017-1.024+. I've got my tank at 1.20 and have coral, feather dusters on the rock, which are very cool, but I don't expect to survive once I put the GSP in the tank, sadly. With one GSP I'm hoping I don't need a protein skimmer (time will tell), but with live rock you'll want a good water circulation pump. With one in a good size tank, you may be able to get away without too much equipment - but I'm still learning too

Gwen

I definitely do not trust much of anything I hear from any pet store employees. I learned that more so with my guinea pigs to begin with but it has certainly proved true for fish as well.

At one LFS one of the employees said a 10 gallon would be fine for a GSP....I mean really?! And he added to that by going on about how I'd be wasting money getting a larger tank.

Another store said a 29 gallon would be fine for two, better than the 10 but still off there. I knew that because I had begun researching GSP before actually going to my LFS.

It will depend on what tank/or setup I can get for a decent price before I decided exactly what size. I will find out more on Monday about a couple used tanks and can hopefully get one large enough for two GSPs. If not, I'll be fine with just one but will take the opportunity for two if it was to happen.

I'm just unsure of how and what all exactly I need. I did not intend on doing a sump and think I'm getting to where I know/understand what is needed but not 100%. Protein skimmer, powerhead, live rock; as far as filtration right?

I do have a few more questions regarding live rock, may just make a topic about it. But anyways..

What would be the minimum live rock needed for one GSP per gallon?
I know at least one of my LFS carries live rock but I know nothing about it including price yet. But how do I know it is good live rock?
Is there a reliable source online to get it? And are there kinds that are best?
If I wanted to start out with both live and base rock what would be a good percentage there and how would that effect the time for the tank to be stable/cycled?

[bertie 83]

1- 1.5 lb per gallon is best for live rock. A sump would be useful. Live rock doesn't last long out of water before you get a little die off

[cal_mul]

1- 1.5 lb per gallon is best for live rock. A sump would be useful. Live rock doesn't last long out of water before you get a little die off

hi there looks like you did some research which is good it will pay off in the long run for you.
i have a marine tank and if possible you would not regret spending more money on a sump as bertie said. they are worth every penny as i'm sure you know those cannisters really are nitrate factories. my sump originally had bioballs in it. but why did i need these when my liverock is enough to handle the bioload of my fish. i removed them and my water quality improved massively since i wasn't producing extra nitrates.
also the salinity of full marine is 1.020-1.025 as bertie said earlier.
hope this helps

[RTR]

Among other things, you need to be well aware that live rock in the quantity needed does displace a good bit of water - that means that the set will actually hold far less water than its nominal volume. The water requirements generally suggested here are for the fish only, you have to increase the tank/system volume to accommodate the live rock. IMHO, there is no justification in moving up through several tanks. After QT, move the fish directly into the final full-sized system.

Very few LFS employees have ever seen a full-sized GSP, much less kept one. Listening to them is shooting yourself in the foot. Do remember that most of them will sell oscars for a ten gallon tank. Duh!!!

[Pufferpunk]

I suggest a tank of 55g for a marine set up for a single GSP & 70g for 2. Nice, long footprint for swimming & plenty of room to make swim-throughs with the LR.

[*GSP*Fan*]

I suggest a tank of 55g for a marine set up for a single GSP & 70g for 2. Nice, long footprint for swimming & plenty of room to make swim-throughs with the LR.

Thank you. I figured I would need to go up a bit in size past the 29 gallon I was considering for one GSP, now that I want to just go full marine.

I was wanting a longer tank vs taller, as the space seems more useful that way. So would a 40gal long/breeder be too small for one GSP set up as full marine?

I've been reading through the topics dealing with marine/saltwater tanks trying to learn as much as I can. It just seems like so much to take in, little overwhelming, and I just want to make sure I do this right.

I know I need live rock, and around 1.5lbs per gallon. I am not sure yet if I will be able to get in without having to order online yet. I know one LFS sales live rock but I have not looked into it anymore, will tomorrow. Is there a good place to get it online? And where I could get a variety? What types of live rock are best?

If I am not able to do a sump, which it is looking that way, what all would I need? Skimmer, powerheads, live rock, live sand...and is that it?

I am still looking for a tank but should have one this week, the size I get will depend on what I do find (I will get the minimum for at least one GSP, possibly two). I've got some I will be looking at from a couple different people who are selling theres. If none of those turn out to be any good, I'll buy new.

[*GSP*Fan*]

Among other things, you need to be well aware that live rock in the quantity needed does displace a good bit of water - that means that the set will actually hold far less water than its nominal volume. The water requirements generally suggested here are for the fish only, you have to increase the tank/system volume to accommodate the live rock. IMHO, there is no justification in moving up through several tanks. After QT, move the fish directly into the final full-sized system.

Very few LFS employees have ever seen a full-sized GSP, much less kept one. Listening to them is shooting yourself in the foot. Do remember that most of them will sell oscars for a ten gallon tank. Duh!!!

Once my full marine tank is setup with the live rock, skimmer, powerhead, etc., I need to have the tank fully cycled, even with it containing live rock, before adding fish correct?

Since I will be setting this tank up specifically for a GSP(s), have not purchased yet, should I still quarantine before adding into the tank setup as full marine or am I safe to put him in after acclimating him/her?

And to the last paragraph of your reply...I recently realized this. The employees I spoke to at one pet store seemed surprised when I mentioned the mature size of a GSP, saying they hadn't seen any bigger than maybe 3inches, maybe less.

[bertie 83]

A 40 g breeder would be ok if you add a reasonable sized sump. Don't let sumps concern you they are incredibly simple and very useful. Quarantine is well worthwhile as you will have live rock in the tank and you never know what a puffer may come in with as they are wild caught. Others may not agree with that tho so please wait confirmation. As for cycling, you need to wait for any die off from your rock and watch your params until stable. Live rock skimmer and powerheads are all necessary

[Pufferpunk]

http://www.marcorocks.com/dryrock.aspx

The employees I spoke to at one pet store seemed surprised when I mentioned the mature size of a GSP, saying they hadn't seen any bigger than maybe 3inches, maybe less.

That's because most have no idea of the real requirements for any puffer, yet alone a GSP. Both of mine acquired 6+"