What does all of this mean?

The forum for puffers that either live or start in brackish biotopes: GSPs, F8s, Ceylons & more.
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Reluctant Puffster
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What does all of this mean?

Post by Reluctant Puffster »

I am in the process of gradually raising the salinity of my green spotted puffer's tank. Yesterday I was doing a water change and did an experiment to see how much salt it took to raise a gallon of water to the brackish requirement he'll eventually need. I put about 1/2 cup of salt in a gallon and got a SG of about 1.015. Afterward, I dumped the gallon into the tank, along with another gallon of fresh water, this adds up to about 1/4 cup for 2g of water. Generally, I've only been putting a few tablespoons per gallon for the water changes, so this is the largest amount of salt I've added to his tank so far, but the SG of the tank water altogether still didn't move the needle on the hydrometer.

This morning he was acting differently, and had an extra pair of spots under his eyes. Instead of flitting around the tank, he seemed sluggish, moving slow around the bottom, and staying amongt the rocks and plants. I took this as a bad sign and did a 20% water change. I also wondered (as I put in another thread) if it had anything to do with an overnight temperature drop.

After the (mostly fresh) water change he seemed to get more energy. He's back to pacing the glass more than I'd like, and the spots under his eyes have faded.

Now I'm thinking I misread everything here. Is it possible he preffered the extra salt in the water? Is it possible the extra coloration under his eyes were good signs, not signs of stress?

I try to interprit everything he does and it's getting a little maddening. I worry because he paces the glass too much. I know his tank is not ideal yet (10g), but he's very tiny right now (about 1.5") and honestly I want to make sure he'll be around for a while before making a major purchase and re-arranging the house for him. He has plants and a cave and a whole bunch of stones to search around, and I've been doing frequent water changes.
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Idontknow
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Re: What does all of this mean?

Post by Idontknow »

Your puffer may have gotten stressed over the salinity change.

What is your SG in your tank now? Also, if you have a test kit what is your pH, ammonia, nitrites, nitrates at?
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Reluctant Puffster
Puffer Fry
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My Puffers: A Green Spotted Puffer named Dante

Re: What does all of this mean?

Post by Reluctant Puffster »

The SG does not even register on the (cheap) hydrometer, making me think the overall salinity is not that much greater than tap water.

My last tests were: ammonia: 0, Ph: 7.6, nitrate 10, nitrite .5.

This was a few days ago. I'm going to test again tomorrow after the tanks settles a bit. I've done so many water changes lately.
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StormySkiez
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Re: What does all of this mean?

Post by StormySkiez »

Was your tank cycled before you started adding the marine salt? You need 0 nitrites and ammonia. Do daily water changes until you have 0 of both. You do not need to be adding more salt right now in an uncycled tank. Worry about getting the cycle complete. Adding more then .02 salt per week can crash your cycle as well. Do you have a thermometer? Big fluctuations in the temp, any trace of ammonia and nitrite can harm him. The temp needs to be between 73-80 degrees. Read the gsp article here: ug.php/v/PufferPedia/Brackish/T_Nigroviridis/

Your gsp needs to go into a 30g asap. When you can do that for him use your cycled filter media from the 10g to help cycle the new tank.

Here is part of a good article about how to cycle your tank:
Reference: http://fish.orbust.net/cycling.html
Quote:
How to save the day (and the fish) with an un-cycled aquarium

..............

1. Immediately do a 10-15% water change with dechlorinated water and continue to do this at least once daily until your tank is cycling (i.e. ammonia and nitrite are at zero).
2. Test the water daily for ammonia and nitrite until the values are holding at zero for several days running. If levels are high, do an immediate, extra water change.
3. If at all possible, get some matured filter media and/or gravel from a matured tank and put it in your tank, suspended in an old stocking. This will hopefully impregnate your new tank with the beneficial bacteria. One lady successfully used floss from a relative's fish pond to colonise her new tank! (you have to be careful that what you use is clean and free from pathogens, of course).
4. Keep good aeration in the tank both to help the fish a little and to oxygenate those beneficial bacteria.
5. Avoid using medications, if at all possible, as many medications kill off beneficial bacteria. Your fish may well get ick, fungus or other infections due to the stress of the ammonia and nitrite but the priority is to get that water quality as good as possible.
6. If you have delicate fish in the tank, such as plecos, corys or other bottom dwellers, tetras, pencilfish etc. try to re-home them temporarily, such as asking the Local Fish Shop to look after them until your tank is cycled (after all, chances are that they got you in this mess in the first place).
7. Live plants can directly use ammonia, so if you can, put some cheap aquatic plants in the tank, such as elodea or giant vallis.
8. Don't feed your fish at all if your ammonia readings are high, and only feed bare minimum rations every other day, until the tank cycles. This will cut down on the ammonia the fish produce. Since fish are cold blooded creatures and don't need the calories of a mammal they can go several days without food anyway, and the occasional fast is good for them. Your fish may not be very hungry anyway so do be careful not to feed more than the fish can eat and clean up uneaten food immediately, before it rots and produces even more ammonia.
9. Only clean the gravel superficially, of obvious dirt and uneaten food. You want the bacteria to colonise it and actually start to grow. Also, don't swap out your filter at this point - if it gets blocked, just clean it enough to unblock it, in used tank water.
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55g-2 green spotted puffers 1 year old Nov 08!
20g-5 leopard danio,4 whiteskirt tetras, amanos, nerita snails, 2 neon tetras
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Reluctant Puffster
Puffer Fry
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 8:23 pm
My Puffers: A Green Spotted Puffer named Dante

Re: What does all of this mean?

Post by Reluctant Puffster »

The tank was not cycled; he went into this tank as an emergency solution. I've been doing daily water changes to compensate for this.

Should I change more than 20%? per day until it cycles?

Also, would it make more sense to try to cycle it as a brackish tank to begin with, since the freshwater bacteria are minimal.

Also also, is said in the inset:

9. Only clean the gravel superficially, of obvious dirt and uneaten food. You want the bacteria to colonise it and actually start to grow.

I always thought bacteria lived in the gravel as well, but some people say they only live in the filter. I'm very confused on this point.
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StormySkiez
Fahaka Puffer
Posts: 679
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 9:00 am
My Puffers: 55G 2- 1 3/4 inch GSP's ~Bud AKA Jaws and Puff~
Location: USA~TN

Re: What does all of this mean?

Post by StormySkiez »

I would do 50% WC's as nessesary to try to keep the ammonia and nitrite down to 0. Prime is a very good water conditioner as it allevates ammonia and nitrite toxicity. I am no expert but I have read advise on here to not worry about adding salt to an uncycled tank. Your main concern right now should be cycling the tank. A good amount of Bacteria does live in the gravel. I had a mini ammonia spike changing all my gravel out in a 10g tank.

You are doing good w/ frequent WC's. Keep a watch on the water parameters. At your puffers size he is not in any harm in Fresh Water. Be patient. It will all come together.
Image
55g-2 green spotted puffers 1 year old Nov 08!
20g-5 leopard danio,4 whiteskirt tetras, amanos, nerita snails, 2 neon tetras
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