"Webb" burrfish?

[Myaj]

Okay, so I stumbled across a poor little starved looking "webb burrfish" today. I've always found these guys adorable and have never seen one locally, and the sunken belly just about made me want to cry.

Anyhoo.. I know the usual mantra, don't buy on impulse, don't buy because you feel sorry for the fish, etc etc. I didn't buy.

Mainly because I'll be out of town for the next 4 days. But, when I get back, if he's still there I just might. He's not very expensive, and I could probably talk the guy down if he finds out I know a bit about them and can give the little buggar a fair chance.

But here's my biggest question.. is a 75 big enough for one? If not, I'll have to pretend I never saw him, that or work some overtime and get my hands on a 110...

[Puffer Queen]

This is a common problem with the chilomycterus schoepfi. They are often worm infested and do not adjust to aquarium life. They will often refuse to eat and will waste away.

[OraLacerta]

I have to add something about the tanksize for these guys-

Now, talking only space, if we recommend minimum of 120 US gallons for a Porcupine puffer, that is keeping in mind the standard footprint of 48x24x24". So, this gives him 5-6 extra inches of turning room assuming his full grown size of 18"-19". I have seen the minimum tank size recommendations for these 10-11" Burrfish species range from 70 gallons to 100 gallons (on here and on http://www.wetwebmedia.com). I feel that, spacewise, 75 gallons is more than adequate for a 10-11" fish if 120 gallons is recommended as a minimum by us for a 19" fish. The standard 75 gallon is a long foot print, 48"x18"x21", and the 18" width actually gives the Burrfish more turning room and swimming room than the Porc has proportionately (5"-6" of turning room). That's 7-8" extra inches of turning room for the Burrfish in a 75 gal., and a nice, long length to cruise back and forth in.

If we are worried about water quality in the standard 75 gallon (assuming the tank holds an actual 60-65 gallons as mine does after adding more than 120 Lbs of sand and 90 Lbs of LR), the min. recommendations we have for the 8" long, larger-bodied Ceylon of 40 gallons means that proportionately (volume-wise) we would recommend that the 10-11" marine puffer have 55 gallons of volume. Now, a 55 gallon is a terrible tank foot print for any puffer over 8" so I would never put anything larger in there, but if we use the Pufferpedia's min. tank size recommendations (using our own minimum recommendations based on our own experiences) which factor in standard tank footprints and water volume, the minimum tank we would recommend for this size of fish would be a 65 gallon (36x18x24), but a 75 gallon would be much better because of the actual water volume when adding LR and sand, and added length.

Then, we can also get into the fact that a 75 and a 90 easily swap out for one another because they share the same footprint. So, one would not need to buy a new stand/canopy if the 75 gallon's nitrates are running too high as the fish reaches full size. Also, we are not factoring in the use of a sump/refugium, etc. which will add to the water volume which may be the only limiting factor of the 75 gallon, but as stated above- if an 8" large-bodied Ceylon has enough water volume in a 40 gallon (actually the actual gallonage will be closer to 30 when decor/substrate is added) then the 75 gallon isn't a bad recommendation.

I have thought deeply about this before purchasing my Chilomycterus schoepfi (as you probably have noticed) and I haven't just considered our very rough Pufferpedia recommendations. I also used my own common sense and experience to judge this by. I think that with the Dogface puffers 100 gallons minimum is a safer recommendation because they are essentially a 12" long GSP with their big bodies, and would be better off with extra water volume. The burrfish, at least the Chilomycterus schoepfi does not get this large football type of shape with that cute 'gut', but rather stays somewhat streamlined.

This is my logic for keeping my 5" (soon to be 10-11") Chilomycterus schoepfi in my 75 gallon. And I am also keeping in mind that if I am somehow *terribly wrong* that I have several options for increasing his water volume should his nitrates run too high at full size.

Also, is this a "Web" Burrfish which gets its common name from the honeycombing/netting type of markings on its body, or the "Lined" Burrfish which is what I have, Chilomycterus schoepfi? Both get to the same size, but I've never seen the actual "Web" Burrfish in a store so it would be cool to see.

Anyways, this was incredibly long-winded, but if the puffer isn't too expensive I would set up a hospital tank for him and treat him for IPs. They have all of the personality of the Porc without the huge size.

[Myaj]

I'm not positive on the ID, and it will have to wait until I get back Monday (at the Dr FosterSmith frag swap right now). I just knew he was a burrfish and very, very thin. Didn't much pay attention to the markings.

He was only $30 and so incredibly gaunt looking I could probably get the price down quite a bit, especially if they are having trouble getting it to eat and I explain about this forum, etc.

So we'll have to see when I get back, if he's still there, what he looks like. Other than the super-gaunt, sunken belly, his color and activity level was excellent. Just looks like they haven't been able to get him to eat yet. I'll have to find out how long he's been there, what they've tried to feed him, etc.

These guys aren't in the pufferpedia are they? I glanced through quick and didn't see anything. What have you been feeding yours Orc?

[OraLacerta]

Poor guy.

My guy was only eating prawns, which was the only thing that LFS feeds their marine fish. I couldn't get him to feed on anything else for the longest time, so I fattened him up on them so I could 'starve' him for a couple of days and he finally tried shrimp, then cockles, and then squid. He still prefers shrimp-like food over most other foods, but soaking his food in vitamins is helping make up for his pickiness.

I hope if you end up buying him that he pulls through because these are such awesome fish. My husband adores my little guy.

They do seem to be rather difficult in captivity as my guy is a big eater but decides what type of food he wants that day, and since I moved him into my 75 he's been on a 3 day hunderstrike.

[OraLacerta]

Did you ever check to see if he was still there?

Btw my guy started eating again after about a 6 day hunger strike which isn't too bad I suppose. It was the prawns that got his appetite going again.

[Pufferpunk]

We have one at my LFS too. I have an "empty" tank but not big enough, I'm afraid. Might get a sharpnose or 2.

[jefferzbooboo]

pufferpunk, Pink Spotted, i'm telling ya. won't be disapointed

[Pufferpunk]

Thanks--just have to find one now...

[jefferzbooboo]

I found one in North Dakota, so you should have no problems. Sorry to sparkler your thread.

[Myaj]

No problem.

I'll stop today on my way to work today or tomorrow and see if he's still there. I was up north all weekend then with the holiday, the store was closed.

[jefferzbooboo]

I must say that webb burrfish looks sweet.

[Myaj]

So guess who came home with me today!

I'll have to get photos up and get a positive species ID.

The store said they've had him 2 months, and he ate from day 2, but only live feeders. He refused any prepared or frozen food. Within a half hour of acclimating him to the tank he was accepting those canned shrimp I mentioned in another thread and ramshorn snails. So at least I know I can use the shrimp to get some vitamins and antiparasitic meds into him, and I'll pick up some "people shrimp" too and start working on those, I don't expect him to give me a hard time though if he was eating dead food this quickly.

The odd part is he really seems to prefer his food at the surface. He'll greedily snatch anything up you dangle in the water, but if it falls to the bottom he'll go look at it and maybe, maybe take a bite at it. But then goes right back to the surface looking for more there.

So right now he's in a 20H, and I'm going to tear down my 75 freshwater (its impossible to get live plants to grow in there for some reason and I hate tanks that aren't planted) and set it up for him over the next few weeks.

[spoot]

If it is a C. schoefii, I'm so jealous! Are you going to get the store to hold him until you are ready for him?

[OraLacerta]

I'm so excited for you Amy!

I can't wait for the pics!

I think he must look like mine did when I saw him at the store- seeming like he was starving to death but actually eating quite a bit. Those IPs are so terrible with these poor puffers. I treated my guy twice and he's bulked up nicely, but I don't think burrfish (or at least the species I have) get that typical round look we expect in a healthy puffer. He keeps a flat tummy but tends to get a bit 'chunky' width-wise if I feed him too much. My guy also seemed to have issues eating food that wasn't suspended in the water, but now he's gotten used to looking for food lying on the substrate. It's fantastic you got him eating already, that's a very good sign. How big is your puff right now?

Good luck with your new puff and keep the updates coming.