newly planted tank needs some help ---

[my name is mike]

its only been about 3 weeks since the plating, but i think im starting to lose the algae battle - help me save my underwater garden!

heres what i got--

Java moss (left on the fake driftwood)
Java fern (far right, big clump 60 stalks or so)
Lace java fern (middle attached to driftwood)
crypt ciliata (front left)
cambomba (back left, barely visible)
vals (background)
moss balls (front)

its a 30 gal with a 65w PC 6700k -- i am dosing with half a cap of excel every day or everyother day (prob averages out to 4 times a week) - half cap of flourish twice a week -- photo period 5hr on, 2hr off, 5hr on. SG is at .001 or lower. PH 8

Both types of java fern are looking good. The crypts are getting algae spots on the leaves. The java moss gets a coating of something or other that shakes off like dust on a shelf when agitated. The cambomba is growing well, but has the same "dust problem." The moss balls look good with the exception of one brown spot on the big one. lastly, the vals look bad, lots of brown tips and melting.

Also, my fig 8 has taken little circle-shaped bites out of the crypts and vals, which cant be helping matters.

Any advice ????

p.s. my HOB filter uses one of those cartridges with carbon in it, i am also using a Pura brand filter pad which has some media embedded in it (could these be a problem?)

[Nick]

When you have a lot of plants, ferts can tip the balance of the war to them, but they can also help the algae... perhaps try reducing the amount. The debris that some plants get on the leaves is common in heavily planted tanks, my DP tank gets it on any plants out of the current, increasing water movement is a solution, as is just shaking them daily. That is all I can think of at the moment, other than perhaps adding water lettuce - it floats, and absorbs light normally given to algae, but too much and the plants below won't get any - since you have mostly low light plants, I think you could get away with it.

[my name is mike]

Thanks for the advice -- 2 questions--

1. do you suggest reducing the excel and the flourish or just the flourish >?

2. will water lettuce survive brackish once i get the SG back up to around 1.005 ???

[Pandora114]

I have nothing constructive to add except:

OMG that's a stunning tank!

[Nick]

I really don't know to be honest, the water lettuice might live, might not. It's going to be a F8 tank then? I'd halve amount of both ferts, and if the algae gets better, experimentally cut back more, if it gets worse, experimentally increase over what you were using originally to find what works best for your tanks chemistry.

[my name is mike]

Thanks nick --- yeah, it's a fig 8 tank --- fingers crossed the fert experiment works -- how long do you think i should dose to see if it's making a difference (a week or so?)

Pandora... thanks, i like how it looks too, that why im desparetely trying to hold on to it -- ha!

[monsterpuffer]

Are you adding any Nitrate, phosphate, or potassium?

I had the same melting problems you are having until I started adding the macro ferts. I started getting some hair algae problems becuase I haven't worked out the balance of the nitrates and phospates though.

Check out http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/ for tips on fertilization. The Fertilator on there is pretty cool for calculating the correct dosage amounts. You can also learn about the different methods people use to fertilize their tanks.

Also, I have heard this works but I've never tried it. If you overdose on excel its suppose to act as an algaecide. Seachem basically has no position on it except to recommend that you stick to the standard dosage.

I have a 20 hex planted F8 tank that gets the brown debris on the leaves. But my planted 75g community does not. It doesnt seem to hurt the plants any. As Nick said - I just shake it off occasionally and it settles to the bottom or gets taken up by the filter.

Tank looks great BTW!

MP

[my name is mike]

Thanks MP !

i am not adding any of the marcos currently -- thanks for the site link, ill check that out -- - that may be my silver bullet

[manutius]

You could make your own ferts by getting the chemicals in powder form and adding to distilled water with added trace element mix instead of a comercial brand which is generally a broad spectrum type dose. Witht he powder form you can adjust the mix yourself to get what works for your tank specifically. I have been doing it in a non puffer tank and plant growth is remarkably better and algae is virtuallt gone. I plan to re-aquascape soon so will get some pics up once its done

[monsterpuffer]

You could make your own ferts by getting the chemicals in powder form and adding to distilled water with added trace element mix instead of a comercial brand which is generally a broad spectrum type dose. Witht he powder form you can adjust the mix yourself to get what works for your tank specifically.

This is what I do. I get mine from Greg Watson. You can search for his site.

MP

[my name is mike]

wow, that fertilator just exploded my head -- i dont know the answer to any one of those questions -- i am adding none of those things --- Nitrate is currently the only one on that list i can answer

looks like i need to do a lot more research --

is there any testing i can do to determine all those levels ??? and then adjust accordingly

[monsterpuffer]

I just assumed all your levels were zero. Because your levels on all the required nutrients should be negligible if you're not adding them.

THen did the calculations based upon what tank size I have and the animals I had in there. I keep the nitrates on the low end to try and maximize the health of the fish.

I can't give you a lot of good answers - on APC they can probably answer the questions a lot better.

MP

[Pufferoni]

I am no plant expert but I am having significant success with 4 planted tanks at the moment and my brackish F8 tank is looking great. I have a thread about it kicking around here somewhere, so I woon't go into what plants and lighting etc.

Vals supposedly don't do well with the excel use. Mine melted away to stubs and as soon as I moved them to a none excel tank they came back.

I have 40 gallon at 0.005 SG and I dose 5ml flourish twice weekly and was using excel 5ml twice aweek. I don't know what size bottle(cap) you are using. I had powdery green algea on the glass. I never had any brown (diatom?) algae as the tank had been running for 6 months before I planted and went brackish.

On the plant site I swear by one of the bonified experts said something so simply it blew my mind.

He said "Algea grows when the balance is off, give the plants what they need and they will out compete the algea."

Some of the additional ferts may help.

I think you should also consider adding a DIY Co2 system. They are easy to use and inexpensive. I use the red sea one as it has many advantages over the Hagen one.

I also think you need more fast growing plants in there. You need nutrient suckers like hornwort, water sprite, or limnophila sessiflora.

[my name is mike]

MP - now that makes sense -- yes, my levels are at zero, (since im not adding anything)- i thought i was just in the dark and that those things were naturally occuring in my tank, with no way to know the levels -- my bad -- thanks for the help. i love that APC site -- tons of stuff to learn and tons of awesome tanks to look at , puts mine to shame

Pufferoi - i had followed your thread -- it helped give me the courage to give this plant thing a try -- i had forgot aobut the val/excel mismatch, but had heard someone else said they did well with excel as long as it wasnt "overdone" -- i think i may have been overdoing it (5ml everyday for a while there) -- i think ill cut it back, more like what you are doing -- if a cut back doesnt work, and i cant get this thing balanced, i'll look into the CO2 you mentioned -- thanks! --

also, more fast growing plants is a good idea -- the cambomba is growing really well -- but id love to add watersprite, it looks awesome in tanks -- does that hold up in brackish ????

[Pufferoni]

It seems to be doing ok in my tank. it is not growing with it's usual speed but still looks niceand reproducing. I will be posting an update in about a week.

I forgot to mention how nice the tank is looking, hang in there.