Mbu Puffer not eating...can somebody pls help!

[Cyclop3000]

Hi all.

My Mbu puffer has not been eating for 2-3 weeks now, he is really skinny, lost a lot of weight, and I am afraid to lose him. Last week he had lost his good humor, would only stay on the sand in the bottom not coming up to me or food. Here are a few details:

- Mbu is a baby, 3-4" max,
- Have had him for 4 months now, usually top health,
- Tank 100g (growout, not permanent...and yes I have read the sticky on Mbus),
- Water parameters ok, couple days ago I noticed the pH abnormally high, can't figure out the reason. I'm trying to bring it down now,
- Weekly 50% water changes,
- Usually moves a lot, excited fish, likes to follow us around and excited about food,
- For the last 2 weeks 4 other fish in there with him: 4" silver dollar, 2x 3" irridescent sharks, 1x 6" clown loach,
- Since I noticed the lack of apetite and change in the puffer I took everything out except the silver dollar. Since then he seems to be in a better mood, and swims much more.
- He is not excited about us, and about food, but when I drop food in there he takes a few bites, spits out most of it after. I can't see his belly rounding out, so i'm thinking he barely eats if not at all.

I feed:
- Cooked shrimps,
- Kryll,
- Pond Snails,
- Opened clams.

In order to try and bring him to eat, I tried small crabs (with their pincers snipped off). He is very interested, but doesn't know how to eat them, or can't get the shell broken.

I also tried mussels, which he doesn't even taste. Bloodworms and the likes he doesn't look at. I tried to get blackworms but here in Canada I can't get themm

Anything else you guys think could happen? Anything else I could feed him that I didn't think of? I thought about internal parasites, so I bought to meds with metronidazole...I will start treatment tonight after water change. Teeths look fine, I don't think they are overgrown.

Please help!

[The Fisherman]

Hi Cyclop3000,

I'm sorry to hear about your Mbu!

Have you tried garlic juice? I've been in a tight spot like that before, where my puffer just wouldn't eat. I soaked some of his food in garlic juice, and he went right for it. The garlic juice is an appetite stimulant. I would try and soak it in a meaty food, something that can absorb it. I used clam meat, but any thing that can absorb the juice should work.

If you can't find garlic juice, you can crush garlic. I usually crush the garlic between 2 spoons, and then slosh the food around in the juice.

IPs are possible, i've had puffers that I thought were clean, and then turned out they had IPs. Thats what happend to me. My Modestus wouldn't eat after IP treatment. The garlic juice did the trick.

Force feeding may be an option too, if it comes to that. That is beyond my experience though.

I'm sure someone else with more experience then me will be able to help you out more.

I hope that helps.

[The Fisherman]

Another thought: How abnormally high is the PH? How long has it been that high? Do you know the tank parameters before, and after he stopped eating?

[Boxermom]

IMO you shouldn't be feeding it cooked food, only raw. But as John said, soaking in garlic usually does the trick if they won't eat. Also, can you get ahold of any ghost shrimp? Those are often good to stimulate the appetite as well as the hunting behavior.

What exactly are your water parameters?

You say he started acting up when you introduced the other tankmates and has been better since you removed most of them. I'd recommend removing all of them if at all possible. Hey may not like tankmates.

[Myaj]

First off, what are your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate readings? What are you doing to lower your pH and what is your pH, what is it normally? Telling us OK doesn't give us anything to go on.

Have you tried a live nightcrawler?

Are his teeth overgrown to the point that he can't eat?

[Cyclop3000]

First off, what are your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate readings? What are you doing to lower your pH and what is your pH, what is it normally? Telling us OK doesn't give us anything to go on.

Have you tried a live nightcrawler?

Are his teeth overgrown to the point that he can't eat?

Alright, I did say that I don't think the teeths are overgrown. They look pretty normal to me.

I haven't tried nightcrawlers in a while, winter here means no worms...so that'll have to wait for spring. But thanks for the suggestion.

I did try ghost shrimps earlier this week. I put a dozen in his tank, but there is no way he can catch one, they are waaaay to fast for him. He did go after them so it actually forced him to swim around.

So to popular demand, here are some stats as of now, right before a water change:

- Ammonia: 0
- Nitrites: 0
- Nitrates: 5-10 mg/L
- pH: 8.5

pH was higher yesterday, I adjusted the pH yesterday night with pH Adjust, from Nutrafin. I also use this to test the rocks and sand...couple drops on the rock and if it fizzles, it doesn't go in the tank. Unfortunately I don't have a reading from before he stopped eating...I have a tendency to test Nitrates and forget pH. I know, shame on me.

When you guys say I shouldn't feed cooked shrimps...well krill is cooked as far as I know, so why would they sell this in every LFS ? I tried krill this morning and he did like it better than the regular cooked shrimps I give him most of the time (could be the shell/legs/head/etc...). He actually ate a couple bites this afternoon, I can see a small bump on his belly so there seems to be food in there.

The garlic juice option sounds interesting, I will most definitely try it.

So what do you guys think of the water parameters? pH? Should I still treat for IP just in case? I don't want to stress him more...

Thanks all for the quick replies!

[Myaj]

What is your pH out of the tap? If its much lower out of the tap I'd do more frequent, smaller water changes to avoid any sort of stress from that. But if its just as high out of your tap, I would rather see you try to lower it naturally instead of using chemicals. Something like using peat pellets or maybe some RO water, but usually its easier to just let the fish adapt to the pH out of your tap than trying to adjust it. I'm curious as to why is higher, if it was a sudden jump or something in the tank or maybe you are on well water and its just that time of the year?

I still pick up nightcrawlers around here, the ones sold for fishing. You guys still have ice fishing in winter, right, or is it too cold for that? Its worth a try though, a slow moving but very tempting-ly wiggling worm is just about perfect for a fish that doesn't feel like chasing something down but needs to eat.

The parameters look good (sorry I had to ask, but if we don't ask we don't know), it very well could be internal parasites or the pH problem. He hasn't eaten lately, but what do his feces look like, are they dark and solid like a normal fish or whitish and/or stringy looking? If that's the case, it could be parasites and that treatment will probably be the next step to try once you figure out why your pH went up.

[Cyclop3000]

What is your pH out of the tap? If its much lower out of the tap I'd do more frequent, smaller water changes to avoid any sort of stress from that. But if its just as high out of your tap, I would rather see you try to lower it naturally instead of using chemicals. Something like using peat pellets or maybe some RO water, but usually its easier to just let the fish adapt to the pH out of your tap than trying to adjust it. I'm curious as to why is higher, if it was a sudden jump or something in the tank or maybe you are on well water and its just that time of the year?

I still pick up nightcrawlers around here, the ones sold for fishing. You guys still have ice fishing in winter, right, or is it too cold for that? Its worth a try though, a slow moving but very tempting-ly wiggling worm is just about perfect for a fish that doesn't feel like chasing something down but needs to eat.

The parameters look good (sorry I had to ask, but if we don't ask we don't know), it very well could be internal parasites or the pH problem. He hasn't eaten lately, but what do his feces look like, are they dark and solid like a normal fish or whitish and/or stringy looking? If that's the case, it could be parasites and that treatment will probably be the next step to try once you figure out why your pH went up.

Well, tap pH is 7.6, so that's why i'm saying it's abnormally high. All my other larger tanks are ok... Like I said I tested everything int he tank, nothing is wrong. I do have a well, but the pH never changes all year round.

I did a 50% water change last night and this morning pH is at 8.0 so not too bad looks like it's going back down. I don't 8.0 can be a problem for the fish...please correct me if i'm wrong.

Indeed they do ice fishing around here, but this year temperatures are so high there's no ice on the river next to my house...so no worms for sale. Just my luck this year LOL.

So last night late he ate another krill, so i'm hoping it's going to get better slowly. I'm wondering tho if I should still start a IP treatment, just in case. What do you guys think about that? Personally I try to stay away from chemicals...what would you guys recommend?

[Pufferpunk]

Go online to some of the cricket farms. A lot of them sell worms also. My puffs love crickets too!

[Cyclop3000]

Go online to some of the cricket farms. A lot of them sell worms also. My puffs love crickets too!

Mmm...If you're talking about blackworms thanks but that won't work...i'm in Canada. There are no such farms that I know of in Canada, and the ones in the US are not able to ship across the border.

I could try and find some earthworm farms tho I suppose...

[Nick]

do you leave the shells from what he eats in the tank? They disolve gradually and increase the hardness, if they are building up quite a bit, that could be the source of the problem...

[Cyclop3000]

do you leave the shells from what he eats in the tank? They disolve gradually and increase the hardness, if they are building up quite a bit, that could be the source of the problem...

Nope I take them out, I knew about them raising the pH...

[manutius]

I would keep water changing and try the garlic fpr sure. When my Mbu got poorly and stopped eating the first thing he ate was a pea and then somew mussel.

I hope you manage to rectify the problem, I know how helpless you feel.

This is what I went through and Iwe managed to pull through. I wish you the same success

http://www.thepufferforum.com/forum/vie ... php?t=7013

[Cyclop3000]

I would keep water changing and try the garlic fpr sure. When my Mbu got poorly and stopped eating the first thing he ate was a pea and then somew mussel.

I hope you manage to rectify the problem, I know how helpless you feel.

This is what I went through and Iwe managed to pull through. I wish you the same success

http://www.thepufferforum.com/forum/vie ... php?t=7013

Thanks for the good words mate. I did try soaking the krill in garlic juice, but when he tasted it he made a weird face saying "hey pal, that's disgusting what'd you put on there??", and didn't eat the shrimp. So I guess that's also not working.

For the past 2 days he's been moving around whenever I get close to the tank, and been taking a couple bites off krill a couple times a day. Subsisting I guess. I did start the IP treatment yesterday night, nothing to lose I guess.

You mentioned your puffer's regular diet includes bloodworms...how do you feed him bloodworms? Live or frozen? I would like to try bloodworms and maybe tubifex, but since I thaw them first they just pollute the tank, too small for him he doesn't see them.

Thanks for the help!

[Pufferpunk]

i wouldn't waste the smaller worms on him. Gotta find those nice, big nightcrawlers!