New to puffers...thinking about purchasing

scrkpr · Post by **scrkpr** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 11:44 am

and I have questions. Of course I have research. I checked out pufferlist.com and dwarfpuffers.com as well as did some google searches. But I have questions I would love to have answered by people who actually own this fish. I'm not a newb to fish-keeping, I've been keeping goldfish for quite some time now. They are hard fish to keep and do it right. I suspect that puffers are the same way. I definately want I dwarf variety of puffer and am think about the irrubesco b/c they are less aggressive.
1.Are these easy to find within the hobby? For example, if I ask my LFS to order should he be able to or am I better of asking for a different type of DP?
2. I have a 10 gal and a 20 gal I can set up as a home for these guys. Obviously the 20 would be better. Is the correct number to go in there 1 male and 3-4 females? Or is that overstocked? I've found conflicting data and don't mind doing large water changes every week for these fish, but don't want to overstock and make poor water conditions.
3. I plan to use live plants and plant moderately using the El Natural method. Are there any plants that I should stay away from?
4.I don't want them to breed. Will they breed all by themselves or is not really a problem? I read in a few places that some varieties of DP will breed without my help. I don't want that.

Sorry if these questions are elementary, but I did try to find the answers myself. I only asked the questions that I found conflicting info for. I want to give them a good home and start off right. Thank so much.

Boxermom · Post by **Boxermom** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 11:49 am

There is only one dwarf puffer. Irrubescos are small, but not dwarves and shouldn't be confused with them.

Real dwarf puffers are half the size of irrubescos.

1. Nope, they aren't easy to find. I've never seen one for sale at the LFS/LPSes around here, and its difficult to find true irrubescos (and not lorteti) online.

For many of your other questions, see the Pufferpedia (link up above).

PuffTheMagicFishy · Post by **PuffTheMagicFishy** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 2:44 pm

I agree. Irrubescos are uncommon in the hobby. I got mine by being in the right LFS at the right time, with the right amount of money.

Kind of a fluke.

Irrubescos are more agressive than DPs from what I can tell.

Correct stocking would be one irrubesco in the ten-gallon or two in the twenty-gallon. Males fight each other. Females also fight each other. Males will attack and kill females, and vice-versa. From what I've seen on this forum, irrubescos do not do well in groups unless the have a huge amount of space to hide from each other in. I believe someone on this forum has a successful group of 3-4 irrubescos living in a 90-gallon heavily planted tank. Others have reported mate killings amongst their irrubescos, even after successful breeding, so I think that for practicality's sake one irrubesco in the ten-gallon tank would be best (though the puff would probably be even happier by itself in the 20-gallon!).

If you went with dwarf puffers, you would be much more likely to be able to have a good group going. Many people have had great long-term success with housing these guys in groups. Males will fight if not given enough room. Each dwarf puff needs 5 gallons of tank space for itself. Some say 3 gallons is OK, but 5 seems to be better for the puff's quality of life. So, you could put 2 in the 10-gallon or 4 in the 20-gallon. One cool thing about dwarf puffs is that you can often keep otocinclus catfish with them, which will clean up your algae for you. So, you could probably get away with three dwarfs and three otos in the 20-gallon. Otos need to be in goups of at least three, because they are a schooling fish. If you went with this plan, you could keep the 10-gallon tank in reserve as a hospital/quarantine tank for sick fish or to separate out any bullies.

I'm not so sure that breeding would be a problem. Hopefully someone with breeding experience will pop by and help you out with that one.

I'm just starting out with live plants myself, so maybe someone with more experience can answer your plant question for you. Definitely avoid all poisonous plants, as some puffers like to sample each plant several times to make sure it isn't edible. One of the small plants I put in my irrubesco's tank looked like green Swiss cheese until she gave up and let it grow out some new leaves.

Post by **Pufferpunk** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 3:04 pm

If you don't want breeding issues, then stick w/all female DP. According to Dr Ebert, the lortetis & irribuscos, are best kept in pairs, I'd say 10g ea.

scrkpr · Post by **scrkpr** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 8:47 pm

Well, I would like to keep to a group so it looks like DP it will be. Thanks for the advise. Now I just need to get that 20 gal tank planted. I love ottos and the way they school and have plenty of experience with them so they will def. go in my tank. I think I will try 3 DP and 3 otto to start. And try to get all girls if I can sex them accurately. I hope they don't eat up all my plants

Boxermom · Post by **Boxermom** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 8:49 pm

None of mine have ever touched a plant that I can tell.

Fugu · Post by **Fugu** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 8:50 pm

It's very easy to sex DPs. If they have a keel stripe they're male and if not they're female.

Boxermom · Post by **Boxermom** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 9:16 pm

Not entirely correct. Most males get the belly stripe, not all do, and some females get it. The only sure way to sex is the eye wrinkles. Males always get them, females never do. Unfortunately, they are usually sold as juveniles before the eye wrinkles appear. So if you get one without eye wrinkles, it could either be a juvenile male or a female. I ended up with three males, but fortunately there were no aggression problems, which I attribute (incorrectly or not) to the lack of female presence. No one to fight over.

scrkpr · Post by **scrkpr** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 10:00 pm

Is it true that DP need a sand substrate or they will get torn up? That makes it harder to plant in. I much prefer a small gravel, but if the DP need it I will get a dark sand.

Post by **Myaj** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 10:13 pm

Dwarf puffers are not fish that bury themselves, so you can use whatever substrate you want.

I don't think breeding would be an issue, I had a pair for a few years that never had any fry. I figure if they did, they either ate the fry or the babies just didn't find enough to eat (or I haven't found them yet!). Either way, they don't breed like mollies or kribs, they are more of a speciality fish to breed, not impossible, but not easy either.

Good luck on the setup!

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 11:48 pm

Boxermom wrote:The only sure way to sex is the eye wrinkles. Males always get them, females never do.

I have also noticed with most DP's I have seen, including all of mine, the females have more intense and definite green-blueish spots than the males. Of course, their colors can fluctuate/fade from one second to the next, so it isn't very reliable...but once you've seen males and females and can recognize them, it can be just another way to do so.

scrkpr · Post by **scrkpr** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:54 am

It sounds like I'm gonna a great a little fish! I'm glad I can use any substrate I want. I figured I could b/c they didn't burrow but wanted to double-check. It sounds like it may be hit-or-miss on the gender but I will try my best to get all girls and if I don't hopefully things will still work out. I have a lot more research to do now on puffer medicines and and QT routines.....off to research

(I'm used to fish with scales, things are way different now!)

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New to puffers...thinking about purchasing

New to puffers...thinking about purchasing