Well I thought I would get lucky enough and not have to treat my puff with ICH but it appears he has broke out with a case of it. At first it was one white spot which I assumed was from bad nutrion and just similarto a cold sore but today they have spread. I have been caring for this newly established tank twice or so a day because the bilogical filter is still not fully established. The nitrites have climbed which I am sure triggered him to break out with ich. I have been doing frequent water changes to lower them but they are still detecting with my test kit around .25 ppm. I have read for countless hours on what to do in this situation and I would like you girls/guys to correct me on any of these steps I plan on taking.
-First I plan on doing a large water change (around 75 percent)
-Then before filling my 125 back up I plan on removing the live rock (there is only about 20 pounds) I will then place it all in a tub for a month to two months with a hang on filter.
-Next I will slowly lower the salinity over a 24 hour period to 1.009.
-I will then increase the temp slowly to around 82 degrees.
-Then I will closely monitor my Puffer and the water levels to keep them at the lowest possible reading.
-Over the first week if the ich continues to get worse I will probably introduce a small amount of copper but monitor its levels extremely close as to not let it injure my scaleless fish anymore.
I will also soak all of his foods in vitamins as well. Does this all sound alright or am I missing any important steps? He is a rather large puffer (around 8 inches) And I am confident He can get past the ich with the proper steps taken.
Thank you everybody!
-Peter
Urgent advice needed please
Forum rules
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
-
puffergeek
- Figure 8 Puffer
- Posts: 179
- Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 11:41 pm
- Gender: Male
- My Puffers: 7 Carinotetraodon travancoricus
1 Carinotetraodon irrubesco
1 Dichotomyctere nigroviridis - Location (country): US
- Location: Greater Seattle Area
What kind of puffer is this?
Also (and this may go without saying) don't forget a heater with you LR. My curing tank heater died once and within a day I had "dead rock".
I'd agree that the nitrite spike may have caused the breakout; any idea why that happened? It might be the root of your problems.
Your treatment plan sounds okay, but you'll need to be careful of ammonia and nitrite...
Also (and this may go without saying) don't forget a heater with you LR. My curing tank heater died once and within a day I had "dead rock".
I'd agree that the nitrite spike may have caused the breakout; any idea why that happened? It might be the root of your problems.
Your treatment plan sounds okay, but you'll need to be careful of ammonia and nitrite...
Peter -
Be careful dropping your salinity too fast. I did this recently (dropped it from 1.024 to 1.011 in a three day period) and had some problems... my pH dropped drastically (it fell off my scale) and my ammonia spiked slightly. Definitely monitor your water parameters closely.
Do you have a quarantine tank? It might be safer to move your puffer (and any other fish in that tank - they'll all be exposed to ich at this point) over to the quarantine tank and drop the salinity on that tank instead of your display tank. That way you could leave your LR where it is and not worry about disrupting your biological filtration.
Good luck...
Dan
Be careful dropping your salinity too fast. I did this recently (dropped it from 1.024 to 1.011 in a three day period) and had some problems... my pH dropped drastically (it fell off my scale) and my ammonia spiked slightly. Definitely monitor your water parameters closely.
Do you have a quarantine tank? It might be safer to move your puffer (and any other fish in that tank - they'll all be exposed to ich at this point) over to the quarantine tank and drop the salinity on that tank instead of your display tank. That way you could leave your LR where it is and not worry about disrupting your biological filtration.
Good luck...
Dan
Dan.. very good point on the bilogical filter. I am afraid I will have to transport the LR rather than my puffer though because he is rather large. I have a 20 gallon long that he would fit in but be very unhappy. Er.. Complicating stuff.. If my biological filter gets ruined I guess I will have to start all over and just do water changes every other day. Oh well I am determined to get this problem resolved and get my puffer back to good health.
Thanks
Thanks
-
Puffer Queen
- Mentor
- Posts: 386
- Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:35 am
- Location: Louisville, KY
- Contact:
Do NOT raise your temperature!!! This decreases the oxygen levels in the water. The puffer already has compromised oxygenation secondary to the parasites. Stress (from parasites) increases the metabolism rate which increases the oxygen consumption which further increases the metabolic rate....
Raising the temperature may shorten the parasite life cycle slightly (less than a couple days) but at the expense of suffocation or further stress/compromised immune system and possible secondary infection.
I would NOT recommend mixing copper and hyposalinity. This can lead to major pH issues and you already have issues with your biological filtration/nitrites. Mixing the two can lead to potential toxicity. Adding a "little" copper will not help - copper needs to be dosed at full strength in order to be effective. Dosing at half or quarter doses can lead to resistant strains of parasites - then you will really have problems!
Raising the temperature may shorten the parasite life cycle slightly (less than a couple days) but at the expense of suffocation or further stress/compromised immune system and possible secondary infection.
I would NOT recommend mixing copper and hyposalinity. This can lead to major pH issues and you already have issues with your biological filtration/nitrites. Mixing the two can lead to potential toxicity. Adding a "little" copper will not help - copper needs to be dosed at full strength in order to be effective. Dosing at half or quarter doses can lead to resistant strains of parasites - then you will really have problems!
Kelly
-
Puffer Queen
- Mentor
- Posts: 386
- Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:35 am
- Location: Louisville, KY
- Contact:
High nitrites do not "cause" ich. The parasite was in the tank. Stress can lower the puffer's immune system and allow it to become vulnerable to parasites. The presence of parasites in the tank causes chronic stress which is constantly stressing the immune system then when an acute stressor (increase in nitrites, new fish, power outage etc) occurs, the puffer can no longer "take it" and falls victim to the parasite or in the case of a power failure, the puffer would not be able to take it and might die or even develop a secondary bacterial infection.
Ridding the display tank of the parasite is the key.
Ridding the display tank of the parasite is the key.
Kelly
Thank you very much for the helpful responses puffer queen! I have not placed a heater in my display tank with my puffer and have a tempature of 80 degrees.. is this still a little to high? I was considering freezing 2 liters to place inside to cool it down a bit. My puffer seems to still have very normal behavior and swim around happy. The majority of the ich is built up on his fins and there are a few that attached on the eyes. I caught it very early so hopefully all will go well. I have been slowly dropping the salinity to around 1.009. I bought PH buffer 8.3 in case I have a PH crash in the next 30 to 40 days. As for my live rock its in a 20 gallon long with a light on it and a heater to keep it at a steady tempature. I am soaking all of his foods in a vitamin supplement. When can expect to see the parasites fall off his body after the hyposalinity has been performed?
Thanks a bunch everybody!
-Peter
Oh yeah, how do I attach pictures to my posts?
Thanks a bunch everybody!
-Peter
Oh yeah, how do I attach pictures to my posts?
-
Puffer Queen
- Mentor
- Posts: 386
- Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:35 am
- Location: Louisville, KY
- Contact:
I prefer to keep my tanks cooler. Blowing a fan over the surface will lower the temp. Watch evaporation closely as swings in salinity will affect the treatment. The life cycle of ich can be better explained in this thread:
http://forum.marinedepot.com/Topic31173-10-1.aspx
It will take several days to weeks till you see full resolution/recovery. Make sure you keep the salinity down for at least 4 weeks after last visual spot to assure full eradication of the parasite.
Best of luck.
http://forum.marinedepot.com/Topic31173-10-1.aspx
It will take several days to weeks till you see full resolution/recovery. Make sure you keep the salinity down for at least 4 weeks after last visual spot to assure full eradication of the parasite.
Best of luck.
Kelly
-
Puffer Queen
- Mentor
- Posts: 386
- Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:35 am
- Location: Louisville, KY
- Contact:
-
Pufferpunk
- Queen Admin
- Posts: 32979
- Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 11:06 am
- Gender: Female
- My Puffers: Puffers I have kept:
T lineatus
T miurus
A modestus
T biocellatus
C valentini
C coranata
C papuan
C lorteti
DPs
suvattii
burrfish
T niphobles - Location (country): USA, Greenville, SC
- Location: Greenville, SC
- Contact: