Do SAP's eat live fish?

By_a_coo · Post by **By_a_coo** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 7:35 pm

Hi, this is my first time here... And I have a question:

I'm still planning a tank for a SAP, and I'd like to know if SAP eats live fish?

Tks for any help.

Fella · Post by **Fella** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 7:51 pm

They can, but should not be encouraged to. I would not deliberately feed a fish that eats invertebrates in the wild to consume live fish.

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 8:50 pm

Hey,glad to hear you are thinking things through your fish will only benifit from the research you are dooing now!. As for live fish they are not the proper diet for most puffers, and can give them serious health issues. sick with the guidlines in this article, wearing down their teeth is especially important for SAP's so hard shelled food is needed.

http://www.thepufferforum.com/articles/puffer/food.html

Post by **RTR** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 10:12 pm

But they can be fin nippers of tankmates - less so than many puffers, but "less" so is not much of a promise.

Post by **nmonks** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:29 pm

Indeed. But I think you can improve the odds in your favour. I've found fast-moving midwater fish avoid SAPs easily, while bottom-dwellers seem not to. Corydoras and gobies got nipped. Bleeding heart tetras and glassfish do not. Halfbeaks seem fine, too. Oddly, Synodontis are ignored, for reasons I cannot fathom.

Personally, if I was doing an SAP tank, I'd look at getting a whole bunch of them, and forget about tankmates. They do like the company, and seem to follow one another about, and at night they congregate in their favoured corner. I think that would make a good fun tank.

Cheers,

Neale

RTR wrote:But they can be fin nippers of tankmates - less so than many puffers, but "less" so is not much of a promise.

By_a_coo · Post by **By_a_coo** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:35 pm

Right, tks for helping...

I just asked that, because I wanted to know about its nourishment; actually, I'll get just ONE SAP in my tank (19g is ok, isn't it?)
I was reading the text about feeding a SAP, the author mentioned silversides (probably dead I guess). What you think about it??

And I don't know if it's gonna be easy to find snails around here... I'll check this out...

RachelS · Post by **RachelS** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:50 pm

Buy some frozen prawns and mussels etc with shells on and defrost. This way the SAP is getting 'safe' fish and it's helping his teeth

You'll still need snails though if you want to avoid dentistry. Post where you are in the wanted forum and see if anyone nearby can give you a few to start breeding them

Post by **RTR** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 3:22 pm

Agree w/Neale on cory cats - they are the unfortunate targets for every puffer known. Those dorsals are just irresistible for some reason, and the caudals not far behind (no pun intended).

Bleeding Hearts are great fish IMHO, even with their flowing dorsal they can and do really move. But I won't use them anymore in less than a 4' tank. Like rainbowfish (which also really move, only moreso), they just don't look right to me in less than four feet of swimming space, and more is better.

Why do you suppose other fish in general stay away from Synodontis? Even the non-predatory filter feeders seem to spook everybody but plecos. Do you thing that they smell/taste bad or something?

Fella · Post by **Fella** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 5:40 pm

RTR wrote:Agree w/Neale on cory cats - they are the unfortunate targets for every puffer known. Those dorsals are just irresistible for some reason, and the caudals not far behind (no pun intended).

Bleeding Hearts are great fish IMHO, even with their flowing dorsal they can and do really move. But I won't use them anymore in less than a 4' tank. Like rainbowfish (which also really move, only moreso), they just don't look right to me in less than four feet of swimming space, and more is better.

Why do you suppose other fish in general stay away from Synodontis? Even the non-predatory filter feeders seem to spook everybody but plecos. Do you thing that they smell/taste bad or something?

I think that synodontis have a few things going for them in their favour -

- most are not active during the day
- the ones I haev kept have hard sharp pointed dorsals and pectorals
- They can create noises. Mochokidae catfish are also known as "squeaker cats". I could hear mine through the tank glass. To another fish, Im sure this would be a deterrent.

Post by **RTR** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 6:10 pm

but most plecos are nocturnal, have equal spines, and while not noisy, they are clunky. A draw on that for me, and few fish are leery of plecos.

Post by **Pufferpunk** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 6:46 pm

All my fish are leery of my giant goldspot! She's mean! Kicks my 12" fahaka out of his cave. I won't even put my hand near her, in feat of getting violently spiked!

Post by **nmonks** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 5:42 pm

I always liked Dr. Paul Loiselle's descriptions of scavengers for the cichlid tank. On Synodontis, he said:

"Synodontis combine a tough skin, formidable fin spines, and a decidely Moses-like committment to repaying transgressions against their persons in kind."

And on large plecs:

"No cichlid once chances by a large Panaque or Hypostomus seems inclined to provoke a repeat performance!"

Certainly, my SAPs have never nipped the dwarf synos or the royal panaque, though that may well be because both are hidden during the day.

I'm with RTR on bleeding hearts. Outstanding fish. Seem to be tough, colourful, entertaining in their squabbles, and easily fast enough to avoid pretty much anything (except maybe a pike cichlid?). Hatchets seem to do well, but when startled they jump, and a few of mine have lost scales from hitting the hood. Halfbeaks are like bleeding hearts; given the space, they outperform most aquarium fish. Again, they're potential jumpers. On the flip side, I'm not convinced neons and cardinals and those sorts of tetras would be good with SAPs.

Cheers,

Neale

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Do SAP's eat live fish?

Do SAP's eat live fish?