Planted Tank

[goldielocke76]

Ok, so, we are seriously considering upgrading Luau to a 29 gallon tank. If this happens (we make the decision on Sunday when we see the new place) I am also seriously considering moving PZ to the 20 gallon with two buddies (she hangs out in a corner all day and darts away when she sees us?) I was going for a male and another female. But I would like to plant the 20 gallon for them, as well as the 10 gallon for the otos and possible betta. So there's my back story, now for my question:

What should I consider when thinking of a planted tank, and, how do you keep a planted tank alive (ie maintenance, start up supplies, etc). I know nothing of this at all, so feel free to comment and suggest away =)

[bertie 83]

I am on a similar venture. Have spent years replacing plants that don't last too long, but bored of spending £££££ on ferts to try to keep them alive. Good luck

[LilGreenPuffer]

What should I consider when thinking of a planted tank, and, how do you keep a planted tank alive (ie maintenance, start up supplies, etc). I know nothing of this at all, so feel free to comment and suggest away =)

I'm going to assume that you want a low- to medium-tech tank. High-tech is incredibly expensive and complex. I run medium-tech, myself. Here's what you need to consider:
-Light - how much, what kind?
-Fertilizers - what kind? Carbon - liquid, DIY, or none? Substrate - inert or fertilizing?
-Aquascaping - what style? What materials?
-Plants - what kind can I have with the technology I'm using?

Light is the first thing to think about. It can get pretty expensive, but you can generally get away with whatever your tank already provides. Check the bulbs and see how many watts each one has; divide by the number of gallons. That's your "watts per gallon" (WPG). You also need to consider how deep your tank is. It's counterintuitive, but you need fewer WPG in a deeper tank. In a typical 20g, 1WPG is pretty low, and 2.5WPG is on the high end of medium. If you don't have enough light, you'll need to either buy new bulbs or look into a DIY solution. I went with DIY.

Fertilizers are the next thing. In a small tank like your 20g, and if you're not going high-tech, I think that what's easiest is to buy premade liquid fertilizers and use the recommended dosage as you see fit; you'll be able to work this out over time based on your tank's needs and the local water. I use Seachem Flourish's whole line - macronutrients (nitrogen, potassium, phosphorus), micronutrients (the basic regular Flourish, plus occasionally iron), and carbon (Excel). I follow the recommended dosage and it's working fine for me and my local water, with adjustments only for tank stocking levels and nitrogen dosing.

Carbon can come in a liquid form, like the Excel that I use, or it can come in gas form. You can build or buy really complicated pressure systems for gas, but if you're just starting out and don't plan to go high-tech, you don't need or want this. You can do gas carbon with a DIY system made from empty soda bottles, airline, and a yeast/sugar/water mixture. I've done it before, and it was tricky to get started, but fairly simple overall. Liquid is definitely simplest; you get a bottle of the stuff and pour in the correct dosage every day.

I like sand for my substrate. One of my tanks has Seachem flourite sand for planted tanks; the other one has pool filter sand. They're both fertilized with Flourish gravel tabs (I don't know why they're called gravel tabs when you can use them for any substrate). You can also try earthy substrates like Eco-Complete and other premade planted tank substrates, which are fertilized, or you can do a DIY substrate using various complicated things like kitty litter that I don't really understand. I haven't looked into those, but you might try it. I don't recommend gravel.

Keep in mind that the wrong balance of light, carbon, and other fertilization can cause issues - either slow growth or algae. Read up on this!

Aquascaping is fun. There's some distinct styles, like Dutch and "nature." I like Dutch best. You can get really into aquascaping and take a mathematical approach, or you can just put things together in a way that looks/feels right. Look at other tanks for inspiration. Think about driftwood and stone ("hardscape"), substrate, and plants. Shapes, colors, and empty space are all important. This is the artistic part!

Finally, plants! In a low- or medium-tech tank, you can actually have a pretty wide variety. Low-tech is kind of limited; things really opened up for me when I did my DIY light upgrade and went medium. You'll want to look up plants individually to see what their care requirements are, but a good starting point would be to look into mosses like java, ferns like Amazon and java, crypts, floaters like frogbit, anubias, swords, and a few stem plants like wisteria and water sprite. Avoid most things with red tones; leave those for the high-techers. Dark greens are usually safe, and some medium greens are easy too.

I got a lot of good, clear, solid info on planted tanks from the plantedtank.net guide, which cost me something like ten or twenty bucks and is an e-book that I have to access online.

[Iliveinazoo]

Good info. from Lilgreenpuffer.

First I'd work out your initial budget and ongoing budget then seriously consider the maintenance that you are willing to put in:

A low light tank with moss, anubias, crypts & java ferns is your cheapest and less labour intensive requiring little or no ferts inc. Co2.
A high light tank with daily fert. dosing and Co2 injection will be the most costly and labour intensive but you will be able to grow any aquatic plant that you wish.

Maybe have a flick through the tropica website and planted tank forums and choose which plants that you would like to grow and see if your time/budget suits.

http://www.tropica.com/plants.aspx

[kcartwright856]

Thank you for this thread! I'm planning a planted tank and this is some great info!

About Flourish tablets and liquid... Are these safe for all tank inhabitants? I read somewhere that inverts can be sensitive to such things.

[LilGreenPuffer]

As long as you don't overdose, they should be totally safe. I've never had any problems.

[kcartwright856]

Excellent! Also, I was wondering if I could get your thoughts on how to do some good burst-growth in the few months before I get inhabitants in my tank.

I was thinking that I could do Flourish tabs and liquid, but also follow one of the designs for a homemade CO2 diffuser. I read that CO2 can be iffy when you have inhabitants in the tank, but it shouldn't be an issue in a tank with just plants, correct? Also... is there such a thing as too much CO2? Should I just do one bottle and diffuser, or several?

And how do I go about maintaining a cycle in a planted tank without inhabitants? Do I need to keep adding ammonia?

Sorry to be so long-winded, and I hope that the OP doesn't mind my questions. I just want to make sure that everything is perfect.

[LilGreenPuffer]

The only way to get fast growth is lots of light, carbon, and ferts. If you add lots of carbon and ferts, you won't get anywhere without lots of light as well.

Yes, you should add ammonia to keep the cycle.

Too much carbon dioxide can definitely hurt animals (and also Excel overdoses can hurt shrimp, even though it's not actually carbon dioxide); that's why pressurized systems are so complex. But bottle diffusers don't really put out enough to cause issues. A friend of mine who used them long-term had about three one-liter and two-liter bottles going on a 10-20g, I think... It really depends on how much gas you get, and that depends on how you do your mixture proportions and the warmth of the room and so forth. Based on my reading, it should be completely safe to run DIY CO2 without a drop-checker. I would start with a two-liter bottle and see where that gets you; if you have signs of deficiency or algae, that would be a cue to add another bottle. In a low-light tank, you really shouldn't need much more than that.

Since the OP has the same general questions as you, I think it's fine for you to hijack, as long as goldielocke76 doesn't mind.

[goldielocke76]

Yeah it's great info, but it makes me sad. Other than a light to go in the hoods I already have (and I am not sure that is good enough) sounds like I might not be able to do a planted tank like I really want too = / the best I can do is some hardy plants that can use what light i have unless there is a better solution? Can I just get a better bulb and have it be sufficient? I am not sure ><

So, pending on budget, looks like Luau will be moved to a forever home tank-- a 36 gallon bow front. There is space in the new place! ^.^ So that means PZ and two more DPs (male and female if I can find older ones) will be in the 20 with some ghost shrimp and 4 nerites, and Luau will be in the 36 with the other 4 nerites and maybe some bottom feeders? (not sure if that is possible). Also, going to look into a sump refugium for my 60 gallon, so I am stoked. Everyone is upgrading and I will get my betta. =) Got lots to do and think about. A planted tank is not totally out of the question, but after reading LGP's post, it looks iffy = /

[LilGreenPuffer]

Yeah it's great info, but it makes me sad. Other than a light to go in the hoods I already have (and I am not sure that is good enough) sounds like I might not be able to do a planted tank like I really want too = / the best I can do is some hardy plants that can use what light i have unless there is a better solution? Can I just get a better bulb and have it be sufficient? I am not sure ><

Yes, you can just get a better bulb. That might be expensive, depending on what kind of bulb you have now. How many watts does your current bulb give you?

[goldielocke76]

Yeah it's great info, but it makes me sad. Other than a light to go in the hoods I already have (and I am not sure that is good enough) sounds like I might not be able to do a planted tank like I really want too = / the best I can do is some hardy plants that can use what light i have unless there is a better solution? Can I just get a better bulb and have it be sufficient? I am not sure ><

Yes, you can just get a better bulb. That might be expensive, depending on what kind of bulb you have now. How many watts does your current bulb give you?

15w on a 20 gallon high. It's a T8. All my bulbs probably need to be replaced-- the 60 and 20 have used ones, the 10 is fairly new, but still could be replaced, and the two 5.5 have goofy small bulbs LoL.

[LilGreenPuffer]

Yeeeeah, definitely you'll want a new bulb. Even low-light plants will struggle with that - java moss/ferns would probably survive, but wouldn't grow.

[Pufferpunk]

I have 2 double strip lights over my 90g with low-light plants & I use the fert from here: http://www.yamatogreen.com.

[GBobNorth]

To heck with the lighting, have you found a plant that can survive a GSP?

[LilGreenPuffer]

PZ is a dwarf puffer.