"occupy" movement

[FADE2BLACK_1973]

Like Obama want more government to be involved in everyones business while we the people wants less government.

Speak for yourself! I am a fan of "big government," and I know many, many people who agree!

I have many acquaintances who refuse to go out & find work because they will get less than their unemployment checks. Some have been on unemployment for 4 years now. They sit at home, depressed, doing absolutely nothing with their lives. They're pretty happy with the movement.

Time to change the income gap! Wages should be more equal; everyone who works full-time should get a living wage. OWS wants this. It's pathetic that the only readily available work doesn't pay a living wage. Full-time at McDonald's won't support a family, but if the corporate owners earned less (which won't hurt them a bit, since they make more money than they can spend) and paid their employees more, wouldn't that be great? This situation will only happen through government involvement; huge businesses won't pay their lower-down workers a living wage unless they're forced to by law. That's because big-business capitalism encourages personal gain, not the common good (AKA ethics!).

LGP, Obama is nothing more than a "spellbinder". All talk--no action. How do you like the "change" he promised?

I love his healthcare, though not as much as the one he tried to pass originally. If I choose to go to vet tech school (seriously considering this), then I won't be able to work full-time, and I won't get benefits. With "Obamacare," I can stay on my parents' health insurance till I'm 26, as long as I'm a full-time student. (Most of my friends are in the same situation, since they are going on to graduate school.) As a person who suffers from mental illness and needs frequent appointments with a therapist and psychiatrist, not to mention my prescriptions, I'd be dead, literally, without health insurance. I wouldn't be able to afford my mental health care, and without my medication, I'd become suicidal again quickly. Obamacare will let me get the job training I need to (hopefully) get work.

I also supported many of the bills he tried to pass without success due to Republican opposition. Obama faces prejudice from those who claim he's not an American or a Christian (come on, religious freedom? this is America - it shouldn't even matter!); he's proven the opposite over and over again, yet made-up stories about "death panels" and being born in Kenya prevail. Obama's inability to enact his *many* of his plans for change are not his own fault.

Here's the plans he HAS enacted:

Big government is bad not good. You dont want the government run everything and tell you what you can and can not do. We have enough useless laws for that already. Law is good, to keep the country in order. BUT way too much law, then freedoms are extremely limited. I dont know about you but I like my freedoms while I still have them. Big Government is Socializem which is what China, Russia, North Korea, and many others are. I would rather die then to live in a country like those. My blood bleeds Red, White, and Blue through and through and I would fight for my god givin rights before this country ever ends up like that (thats what our boys and girls do everyday overseas) and I know Im not alone. Btw, ever since Obama has been a so called President, our unemployment rate has risin higher then anyother. He is always blaming George W. Bush for his (Obama's) mistakes and failers. Obamas overspendin is another big issue. And another thing, that junk you posted up there about "WhatObamasDone" was wrote up by a Liberal. Let me say this, most of Obamas moves he has done is terrible and caused alot of what is wrong with this country today.

[goldielocke76]

I also know people who wont work because its too easy not to. It's struggling families and the elderly who need help. If I had a little help I would not have to work myself to exhaustion and be able to enjoy my annual leave instead of spacing it as recovery time. I work days and my wife works nights so when do we spend quality time? All because our government here forks out on many foreigners. Now don't label me a racist but when people come here and take our council houses and refuse to work, but can afford a nice posh motor something is very wrong

+1 Bertie! There are alot of upset people in California right now. (I can only speak for CA because that is where I live). Lots come here to work, get all the help they need, and then never leave. While others, who have come to the US/CA legally, who have worked themselves to the bone to learn the language and be a part of the working culture, etc, etc, etc. I am upset, but I know a lot of people who came here the right/legal way are way more p/o'd than I am.

Sorry to hear that you and your wife can't spend a lot of time together. That's very tough = / wish I could say something to make it better, but I know there isn't anything I can say. I can hope for the best, and send good thoughts your way though =)

[J-P]

Then how can we be at the point if the costs are prohibitive?

Ummm because of the monetary system that we are currently using...

Have you seen the video on the "bloom box"?
http://www.bloomenergy.com/

do you have any idea how much that costs? Why does it cost so much? Because the company that developed it got funding form somewhere and they expect a profit. They took a good intention refined it and exploit it.

Solar energy, tidal energy all of these are a reality NOW. Why can't we just implement them? What does a profit give you? It gives the person making obtaining the funds a more comfortable lifestyle. What if we could provide that lifestyle anyway; provide a comfortable lifestyle in a productive manner of their choosing?

You cited the Puffer Forum as a community helping each other out but helping each other out with knowledge is one thing and helping each other out with your hard earned paycheque is another thing entirely.

Not really. How much does a consult cost in any field? Typically $65+ per hour. That is pure knowledge. How you "earn" your pay cheque is your choice. There will always be people ready and willing to do what you do out of interest alone. They just need a mentor and guidance.

There is the fundamental question: "What would you do if you didn't have to worry about money?" The basic necessities of life are taken care of; shelter, transportation, education, food and water, electricity and health care. What would you do?

This forum is a prime example. So is "Doctors Without Boarders", and "Peace Boat" and 1000's of NGO's that operate on volunteer help. We just have to expand that a little to see the full potential. Basic psychology teaches us that "everybody wants to do something". Even if that something is sitting at home. You CAN be productive and entertaining form home.

Things don't HAVE to be the way they are. It is time for change... not only to the banking system but out fundamental views of life and what we are doing to this earth in general.

[J-P]

having seen the protests in north america.. they were fairly civil compared to the rest of the world. My wife just asked me to proof read a letter pertaining to the movement over in Japan... Not sure if I will do it, will have to think about it for a while.

[goldielocke76]

Then how can we be at the point if the costs are prohibitive?

Ummm because of the monetary system that we are currently using...

Have you seen the video on the "bloom box"?
http://www.bloomenergy.com/

do you have any idea how much that costs? Why does it cost so much? Because the company that developed it got funding form somewhere and they expect a profit. They took a good intention refined it and exploit it.

Solar energy, tidal energy all of these are a reality NOW. Why can't we just implement them? What does a profit give you? It gives the person making obtaining the funds a more comfortable lifestyle. What if we could provide that lifestyle anyway; provide a comfortable lifestyle in a productive manner of their choosing?

You cited the Puffer Forum as a community helping each other out but helping each other out with knowledge is one thing and helping each other out with your hard earned paycheque is another thing entirely.

Not really. How much does a consult cost in any field? Typically $65+ per hour. That is pure knowledge. How you "earn" your pay cheque is your choice. There will always be people ready and willing to do what you do out of interest alone. They just need a mentor and guidance.

There is the fundamental question: "What would you do if you didn't have to worry about money?" The basic necessities of life are taken care of; shelter, transportation, education, food and water, electricity and health care. What would you do?

This forum is a prime example. So is "Doctors Without Boarders", and "Peace Boat" and 1000's of NGO's that operate on volunteer help. We just have to expand that a little to see the full potential. Basic psychology teaches us that "everybody wants to do something". Even if that something is sitting at home. You CAN be productive and entertaining form home.

Things don't HAVE to be the way they are. It is time for change... not only to the banking system but out fundamental views of life and what we are doing to this earth in general.

+1 hear hear!

[LilGreenPuffer]

Big government is bad not good. You dont want the government run everything and tell you what you can and can not do. We have enough useless laws for that already. Law is good, to keep the country in order. BUT way too much law, then freedoms are extremely limited. I dont know about you but I like my freedoms while I still have them. Big Government is Socializem which is what China, Russia, North Korea, and many others are. I would rather die then to live in a country like those. My blood bleeds Red, White, and Blue through and through and I would fight for my god givin rights before this country ever ends up like that (thats what our boys and girls do everyday overseas) and I know Im not alone. Btw, ever since Obama has been a so called President, our unemployment rate has risin higher then anyother. He is always blaming George W. Bush for his (Obama's) mistakes and failers. Obamas overspendin is another big issue. And another thing, that junk you posted up there about "WhatObamasDone" was wrote up by a Liberal. Let me say this, most of Obamas moves he has done is terrible and caused alot of what is wrong with this country today.

Socializem?

ETA: I had better back out now before I start behaving in a non-modly way. Peace out, y'all.

[FADE2BLACK_1973]

J-P, If Obama gets re-elected samehow (the dead will rise and vote for him again...lol) I might just pack up my family and move up there in Canada. Heard it was pretty with all the lumberjacks and mounties..lol.

[J-P]

J-P, If Obama gets re-elected samehow (the dead will rise and vote for him again...lol) I might just pack up my family and move up there in Canada. Heard it was pretty with all the lumberjacks and mounties..lol.

Canada isn't bad.. just too cold

Money isn't a political, ideological, or a religious idea. Banking is something WE created and something WE have to fix. It has NOTHING to do with Obama. Italy, England, Canada and now Japan are all saying the same things... They are tired of it.

BTW.. the hunters here are pretty out of whack

[FADE2BLACK_1973]

Big government is bad not good. You dont want the government run everything and tell you what you can and can not do. We have enough useless laws for that already. Law is good, to keep the country in order. BUT way too much law, then freedoms are extremely limited. I dont know about you but I like my freedoms while I still have them. Big Government is Socializem which is what China, Russia, North Korea, and many others are. I would rather die then to live in a country like those. My blood bleeds Red, White, and Blue through and through and I would fight for my god givin rights before this country ever ends up like that (thats what our boys and girls do everyday overseas) and I know Im not alone. Btw, ever since Obama has been a so called President, our unemployment rate has risin higher then anyother. He is always blaming George W. Bush for his (Obama's) mistakes and failers. Obamas overspendin is another big issue. And another thing, that junk you posted up there about "WhatObamasDone" was wrote up by a Liberal. Let me say this, most of Obamas moves he has done is terrible and caused alot of what is wrong with this country today.

Socializem?

ETA: I had better back out now before I start behaving in a non-modly way. Peace out, y'all.

Sorry, I meant to spell it "Socialism". Adolf Hilter was a Socialist and a Leftist. He believed in big government and he sure did push big government.

[FADE2BLACK_1973]

J-P, If Obama gets re-elected samehow (the dead will rise and vote for him again...lol) I might just pack up my family and move up there in Canada. Heard it was pretty with all the lumberjacks and mounties..lol.

Canada isn't bad.. just too cold

Money isn't a political, ideological, or a religious idea. Banking is something WE created and something WE have to fix. It has NOTHING to do with Obama. Italy, England, Canada and now Japan are all saying the same things... They are tired of it.

BTW.. the hunters here are pretty out of whack

America was not that bad until Obama took office. Im just tired of Obama. If we can get someone in office that will get this country back in order (the way it used to be) then we would be set. More business', more jobs, less uneployed, cost of living cheaper, less small buiness' shutin down, less useless laws, less dependent on foreign energy, and the list goes on. I know everyone can not agree with everything because it is not in our nature but we would still be in better shape then where we are today. Dont get me wrong I love America but it is changin way too fast and not in a good way.

[Flutter]

Sorry, I meant to spell it "Socialism". Adolf Hilter was a Socialist and a Leftist. He believed in big government and he sure did push big government.

That's silly. Just because Hitler was like that doesn't mean that it is an appropriate reflection of either party type. My grandfather was German, that doesn't make him believe in a superior race or concentration camps. I am of German descent and would be fine with supporting one of my country's left-wing parties but that doesn't make me a socialist. Broad associations like that are dangerous and rarely reflect upon reality.

[FADE2BLACK_1973]

Sorry, I meant to spell it "Socialism". Adolf Hilter was a Socialist and a Leftist. He believed in big government and he sure did push big government.

That's silly. Just because Hitler was like that doesn't mean that it is an appropriate reflection of either party type. My grandfather was German, that doesn't make him believe in a superior race or concentration camps. I am of German descent and would be fine with supporting one of my country's left-wing parties but that doesn't make me a socialist. Broad associations like that are dangerous and rarely reflect upon reality.

Im not talking about the German people. I was only refering to Hitler. Like Im an American but I do not ever want to be compared to Obama. Btw, my ancestors are German. I even have a German last name.

[Flutter]

I forgot to add this to my other post before I went to bed.

Hitler was a Fascist NOT a Socialist.

[LilGreenPuffer]

And China and North Korea were communist countries, not socialist.

[Iliveinazoo]

Ummm because of the monetary system that we are currently using...

Have you seen the video on the "bloom box"?
http://www.bloomenergy.com/

do you have any idea how much that costs? Why does it cost so much? Because the company that developed it got funding form somewhere and they expect a profit. They took a good intention refined it and exploit it.

Solar energy, tidal energy all of these are a reality NOW. Why can't we just implement them? What does a profit give you? It gives the person making obtaining the funds a more comfortable lifestyle. What if we could provide that lifestyle anyway; provide a comfortable lifestyle in a productive manner of their choosing?

I work in Building services and am well aware of the technology that is out there. It is expensive because people have devoted time and energy into researching and developing the product and then putting it through rigorous tests to ensure that it complies with the various legal documents of the countries that they are trying to distribute it to. Yes the research may have been funded from somewhere but that “somewhere” will expect a return on their investment otherwise they would not have invested. Eventually the costs will come down so that every new home will be built with a fuel cell or the like but don’t think that that would be the end of the costs or that the costs would become negligible because people will still have to produce and maintain these systems.

I think that a world without money, where everybody has the same living standards is a lovely concept but it simply can’t work in practice. There needs to be a driver to ensure that people build homes for others, that people develop medicines and provide the food and clothes that we buy at the shops. The majority of people will not go out to work as they do now if the person living next door has the same house and garden and does nothing to contribute to society. If you would carry on working as hard as you do with no obvious benefit or gain then you are a good person but I would suggest that you are in a minority group.

You ask what I would do if the basic necessities of life are taken care of; shelter, transportation, education, food and water, electricity and health care? I would enjoy life, I would tend my garden, I would travel the globe, I would kayak with killer whales in Canada, I would dive with Humpbacks and chill out on Miami Beach, I would spend as much time as possible with my family. The problem with that is that I wouldn’t be designing the electrical systems that go into hospitals, schools or homes. I guess that the majority of others would choose to enjoy time with their families over work to.

What is the alternative to banking? Keeping money under the mattress? The thugs of this world would love that! Maybe the alternative is to trade a sheep for a barrel of carrots – you’ll probably find that is one of the reasons that money was developed in the first place!

This forum is a prime example. So is "Doctors Without Boarders", and "Peace Boat" and 1000's of NGO's that operate on volunteer help. We just have to expand that a little to see the full potential. Basic psychology teaches us that "everybody wants to do something". Even if that something is sitting at home. You CAN be productive and entertaining form home.

I admire volunteers, I think that some do great work but many volunteers do so because they can, because they have other halves or parents that look after them, they would not be able to volunteer if they were working the land in order to feed their families. Basic psychology might teach us that “everybody wants to do something” if something means sitting at home! The animal kingdom from which we originate teaches us that species will only do as much as they need to do to survive and procreate.

Not really. How much does a consult cost in any field? Typically $65+ per hour. That is pure knowledge. How you "earn" your pay cheque is your choice. There will always be people ready and willing to do what you do out of interest alone. They just need a mentor and guidance.

I think that you missed my point; yes people choose a career where they trade knowledge for money because that is how they keep a roof over their heads and I would suggest that the majority of people would not step into my work role without any additional benefit other than interest.