Over the past 2 weeks I've lost 2 dwarf puffers, neither of which showed any sign of illness that I noticed. Not to say that I thoroughly examined them daily, but they werel eating, swimming fine, and didn't have any obvious physical issues (sunken bellies or white spots). I haven't seen another puffer since yesterday, not sure if she's hiding or dead. I'm seriously worried that everything in there is going to die and I'm not sure what to do since I can't find anything wrong... Tested the water tonight after I found the 2nd dead puffer, Ammonia 0, Nitrites 0, pH was a little high at 7.4, can't find a test for Nitrates but with 50% weekly water changes I would think it's ok. I've had them for 4 years roughly and everywhere I look says they live about 5, but to start dropping this quickly can't be right. Should I just put some Melafix and salt in there and hope for the best? Anything not so obvious I should be looking for? Also, what's the safest way to lower the pH a few points into the prefered range?
Tank (prior to all this)
45gal, 78-79 degrees
4 dwarf puffers (down 2, maybe 3)
5 black skirt tetra (down 1)
1 siamese algae eater
a bunch of cone snails
Btw, when I found the 2nd puffer, it looked like it was puffed up, I've never seen them puff and it was pretty chubby to begin with so I'm not 100% the light and angle weren't just messing with me. And a few weeks ago I had a tetra get stuck to the filter, freed it but it didn't make it.
Dwarf puffers dying
Forum rules
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
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EtherealWI
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bertie 83
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- Location: brighton , england
Re: Dwarf puffers dying
Very strange. Dps should live much longer than 5 years ime. How big is your sae? Dps should be in a species tank. I dont think salt will help, infact it may be a bad move. Fish dont read ph so as long as its stable leave it. As for the cause i dont know. Anyone have any ideas?
It's amazing how easy maintenance is. If done regularly and thoroughly
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Reaperpilot2014
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Re: Dwarf puffers dying
You are probably right about the nitrates being okay, but you can get the API nitrate test at Petsmart and Petco or on eBay. It would be good to have one on hand.
If they've been kept in too small of a tank, an overstocked tank, or have had other stress placed on them, their lifespan could have been drastically reduced. IF they were possibly puffed, it would indicate acute stress of some sort. Mine is 8 years and still going strong, so I don't think old age is an issue here. You could try Melafix, but without any apparent maladies, I'm not sure it would help.
I know you said they didn't have sunken bellies, but did you treat them for IPs?
If they've been kept in too small of a tank, an overstocked tank, or have had other stress placed on them, their lifespan could have been drastically reduced. IF they were possibly puffed, it would indicate acute stress of some sort. Mine is 8 years and still going strong, so I don't think old age is an issue here. You could try Melafix, but without any apparent maladies, I'm not sure it would help.
I know you said they didn't have sunken bellies, but did you treat them for IPs?
It's a crayfish! It's a snail! It's a... ah who cares?
Nom nom nom!...
Tank: 4 liter custom-shaped sphere
Contents: 1 Brainfish
Ph: 7.4
Ammonia, nitrites, nitrates: ?
Problem: Cloudy/muddy water
Can you help me?
Nom nom nom!...
Tank: 4 liter custom-shaped sphere
Contents: 1 Brainfish
Ph: 7.4
Ammonia, nitrites, nitrates: ?
Problem: Cloudy/muddy water
Can you help me?
-
Reaperpilot2014
- Fahaka Puffer
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30g - 1 GSP "Demon"
15g - 1 C. Irrubesco "Raoden"
29g - 1 Figure 8 - Looking for good name ideas...
29g - Ramshorn, Marmorkreb, Cherry & Ghost Shrimp Breeder Tank
10 wonderful years with puffers! - Location (country): USA
- Location: Utah
Re: Dwarf puffers dying
Likely that it's not an issue with your weekly water changed, but do you by chance have test results hardness?
It's a crayfish! It's a snail! It's a... ah who cares?
Nom nom nom!...
Tank: 4 liter custom-shaped sphere
Contents: 1 Brainfish
Ph: 7.4
Ammonia, nitrites, nitrates: ?
Problem: Cloudy/muddy water
Can you help me?
Nom nom nom!...
Tank: 4 liter custom-shaped sphere
Contents: 1 Brainfish
Ph: 7.4
Ammonia, nitrites, nitrates: ?
Problem: Cloudy/muddy water
Can you help me?
-
Pufferpunk
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Re: Dwarf puffers dying
Actually I think their normal lifespan may be ~5 years. Maybe RTR knows better.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...
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LilGreenPuffer
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Re: Dwarf puffers dying
Nick said anywhere between 3 and 8 is normal, I think.
"I will give you a talisman. Whenever you are in doubt, or when the self becomes too much with you, apply the following test. Recall the face of the poorest and the weakest man whom you may have seen, and ask yourself, if the step you contemplate is going to be of any use to him or her. Will she gain anything by it? Will it restore her to a control over her own life and destiny? In other words, will it lead to freedom for the hungry and spiritually starving millions? Then you will find your doubts and your self melt away."
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Come and visit http://www.thetriopsforum.com!
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NEED NITRIFYING BACTERIA FOR YOUR NEW TANK? PM ME!
Found among the papers of Mohatma Gandhi
Come and visit http://www.thetriopsforum.com!
I AM A DUDETTE!
NEED NITRIFYING BACTERIA FOR YOUR NEW TANK? PM ME!
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RTR
- Mentor
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Re: Dwarf puffers dying
I would guestimate ~ 5 years with some non-trivial +/- involved. Breeding does shorten lives, in part from the extra stresses involved, but not s much as in some other breeding patterns.
But I do not like the tank mix at all. Black Skirts can be really nasty fish, abd also should be a potential target fof DPs. Plus the SAE is inappropriate in the tank at all.
As for what killed these fish, without any water parameter readings other than temp, I would not even guess.
Healthy fish do not get stuck to filters if the filter is appropriate to the tank. That is generally a sign of severe weakness leading to death from unknown causes without more info.
But I do not like the tank mix at all. Black Skirts can be really nasty fish, abd also should be a potential target fof DPs. Plus the SAE is inappropriate in the tank at all.
As for what killed these fish, without any water parameter readings other than temp, I would not even guess.
Healthy fish do not get stuck to filters if the filter is appropriate to the tank. That is generally a sign of severe weakness leading to death from unknown causes without more info.
Where's the fish? - Neptune
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Reaperpilot2014
- Fahaka Puffer
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55g - 3 SA Puffers "Larry, Curly, * Moe"
30g - 1 GSP "Demon"
15g - 1 C. Irrubesco "Raoden"
29g - 1 Figure 8 - Looking for good name ideas...
29g - Ramshorn, Marmorkreb, Cherry & Ghost Shrimp Breeder Tank
10 wonderful years with puffers! - Location (country): USA
- Location: Utah
Re: Dwarf puffers dying
Looks like mine is a grandpa then!RTR wrote:I would guestimate ~ 5 years with some non-trivial +/- involved.
It's a crayfish! It's a snail! It's a... ah who cares?
Nom nom nom!...
Tank: 4 liter custom-shaped sphere
Contents: 1 Brainfish
Ph: 7.4
Ammonia, nitrites, nitrates: ?
Problem: Cloudy/muddy water
Can you help me?
Nom nom nom!...
Tank: 4 liter custom-shaped sphere
Contents: 1 Brainfish
Ph: 7.4
Ammonia, nitrites, nitrates: ?
Problem: Cloudy/muddy water
Can you help me?
-
sevenyearnight
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RTR
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Re: Dwarf puffers dying
There is a lot of +/- as I said, but I should have expanded that a bit. If 5 is median for well-kept DPs - and well-kept to me means strict;y species tanks, perhaps with some Otocinclus cats, and likely with both sexes present, large-scale weekly partials and heavy planting with real plants.
Other tankmates are likely to shorten lives, but so is successful breeding.
I would expect some fish to die as you as 3 -3.5 years, but few. I would expect some to live to or beyond 8 years, but few of those as well.
HTH
Other tankmates are likely to shorten lives, but so is successful breeding.
I would expect some fish to die as you as 3 -3.5 years, but few. I would expect some to live to or beyond 8 years, but few of those as well.
HTH
Where's the fish? - Neptune