ICH is horrible, really need help that actually works

[JenJen19720]

Hi all,

I've read time and time again that ich is really "easy" to treat and goes away soon with heat and salt. I have not found this to be true! I've been following Pufferpunk's protocol for treating ich for a week now and puff is NOT getting better. He started off with a few white specks, bad color, and hiding, and now he's got more white specks but what's worst is that he's gasping for air at the surface of the water. It's horrible to see. He hasn't eaten for at least a week.

The water temperature is naturally at 82-84 degrees (we live in Texas, it's been record temps all summer long). I use aquarium salt, 1 TBL for each 5 gallons. I'm also using Ich Attack, double dose, three times a day (two teaspoons, three times a day). He lives in a 10-gallon planted tank with four neon tetras who are just fine and dandy. I'm doing everything by the book!

I need, NEED to know what medicine WORKS to kill ich and is safe for a freshwater puffer. If you tell me Melafix, can I combine that with Ich Attack? I know a lot of you don't like to use chemicals in aquariums if not necessary, but I do not want to lose this puff! Please, please someone give me some advice that WORKS!!!

Thank you!

[eieio]

there may be issues other than the ICH
ICH frequently shows up when a fish is weakened by other factors
the info and answers to the questions in the red box above may help determine why the treatment is not working

[sevenyearnight]

Ich will visibly get worse before it gets better.
Make sure you keep the water extremely oxygenated, put an airstone in, the warmer temps and medication in the water lower the oxygen levels, if he is gasping, he's probably not getting enough air.
Make sure you keep up with the water changes, siphon the gravel well, he should be fine, but it can take some time.

[bertie 83]

I used marine salt to rid my f/w puff of ich. Maybe aquarium salt hasn't got the beans to get the job done as effectively

[LilGreenPuffer]

The treatment will take up to 4 weeks. Hang in there!

[JenJen19720]

I just went home to check on him at lunch. He is very pale and very weak. Still drifting vertically at the surface of the water. It seems to me when they are that weak there's no hope. He easily gets swept around by the slight current coming from the filter outflow.

[LilGreenPuffer]

Can you reduce the filter flow? And try some Melafix to help heal the damage to his skin. Plus, try a bubbler, and turn that heat up to 86. You could also try a saltwater dip/bath. The higher salinity can help temporarily relieve symptoms.

[JenJen19720]

I'm not sure if I can reduce filter flow, don't really know how to do that except put more water in the tank so that it covers the water outlet.

I do have an airstone in there too.

How do I do a saltwater bath?

Also, can I combine Melafix with Ich Attack?

I feel like such a failure. I don't know why I can't fix my puffs and everyone else seems to be able to beat ich by following the same instructions. My first puff died a couple of months ago and I didn't know what was wrong because I never saw any spots on him. I did everything I could to help him and I LOVED that fish. I really don't want this one to go the same route.

[Randomtabby]

I am fond of Seachem's Paraguard. It is quite mild on the fish and you can do a one hour dip (watch to make sure the fish does not become more stressed than when you put it in) and treat the tank. I also like Quick Cure. Yes it is harsh but sometimes ICH is harsher.
Heat works to speed up the parasite's life cycle. Make sure you have enough salt/drugs to kill the parasites or you are just killing your fish faster.
When the fish is really covered in parasites I like to move them to a bare hospital tank. That way there are no established parasites hatching out to attack the fish.
I have heard there are some 60 varieties of ICH. They vary in the amount of time spent on the fish, and in my experience also in their resistance to different treatments.
Be sure to keep up treatment long after all spots fall off the fish, I usually continue about 2 weeks.
As far as I know Melefix is safe to combine with most drugs, although personally if treating ICH with drugs I don't use Melefix. Melefix is for treating and preventing mild bacterial (and sometimes fungal) infections.

Not every fish survives becoming ill. There are infinite factors at play, including the genetics of your individual fish. Some fish are stronger than others, and the same goes for the pathogens that attack them. If you try your best and you still lose your fish, take comfort in the fact you did everything possible and gave the fish the best care you could. Learn, grow, and honor your deceased fish with the love you give the next one.

[Randomtabby]

A note about mixing meds with water changes- Water conditioners are reducers- they work by reducing chlorine to chloride. They can also affect some drugs used to treat fish, reducing them to toxic and/or useless (this is especially true for quick cure, and aldehydes such as Paraguard. Less so I believe of most antibacterials. I am not familiar with Ich attack).
This can be prevented by letting your tap water sit in a bucket WITH dechlorinator for one to two days, to let the reducer break down. To raise the temp I usually add some boiling water to the bucket.

[eieio]

i know you're really trying hard to save your fish, and i'm sorry to bring this up again, but since this is the hospital forum and this is the second fish in trouble in that tank, can you fill us in on the water parameters and other info?i may be wrong, but there may be other factors than ICH that are at hand............

[JenJen19720]

Hi eieio, do I really need to post my water parameters when I'm doing an 80% water change every other day? Not to sound like a smartass.

The tank has been established for over a year, and the neons that are in it are showing no signs of distress. Maybe they are more resistant to ich because they have scales?

I can test the parameters tonight but should I do it before or after the 80% change? (tonight is water change night)

I did my last 80% water change on Wednesday.

[LilGreenPuffer]

Those water parameters can sneak up on you, so it's a good idea to be checking. You don't really HAVE to post them, but if you test them and they're anything but zero ammonia, zero nitrite, and less than 20ppm nitrates, then you have a problem. Test them before the water change.

[JenJen19720]

I'm considering doing either a saltwater bath or a Paragard bath for my puff when I get home (depends on if I can find Paragard at my LFS).

I'm worried about one thing though.

When my last puff was lying on his side on the bottom of the aquarium and it was clear he wasn't going to last much longer, I moved him to a one-gallon tank so that the other fish wouldn't bother him or nibble on him after he died. This was in the morning and I had to go to work so I couldn't monitor the situation in the big aquarium.

However, about a minute after I put him in the one-gallon tank, he puffed himself up and then died shortly after he deflated. It was HORRIBLE to watch, I could not BELIEVE how big he got when he puffed. You couldn't see his eyes anymore. He was about the size of a golf ball. I still want to cry when I think about it.

So my fear is that if I move my sick puff into a one-gallon container for a medicine or salt bath, that he will freak out, puff up, and die.

Or is it that all puffers puff up before they die?

[Pufferpunk]

It is very possible that the ich meds you are adding are the cause of his failure. Raise the temp to 88 & add the Melafix, it will soothe his skin.