Yes your tank is overstocked and bioload could be the problem, both of which could be the cause of your fish being sick. Please dont come asking for help and then tell us we are wrong.
I agree with everyone else in saying you need a MUCH larger tank ASAP. You mbu will not live very long in a tank that size. And by your comment that you just moved him to a much larger tank of 150 makes me think the damage may have already been done. What size tank and how long was he in it before?
Midge MBU Puffer
Forum rules
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
-
xrayjeeper83
- Mbu Puffer
- Posts: 4167
- Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 9:31 pm
- Gender: Male
- My Puffers: Fahaka named Bloat
Abei named Huey
GSP named Bacon - Location (country): USA
- Location: Orange Park, FL
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
RTR wrote:Fahakas do not have tank mates, they may have swimming food reserves.
-
Nuclear_Glitter
- Fahaka Puffer
- Posts: 971
- Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 1:03 am
- Gender: Female
- Location (country): North Carolina, USA
- Location: North Carolina, USA
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
This is what his "My puffers" thing says: I own A MBU, bought 13th July 2010, it is called Midge. Housed in a 88 Gallon Tank External Filter Ehiem Pro 3. HMA water system, Blue and white lights for night and day. 2 Heaters.xrayjeeper83 wrote:Yes your tank is overstocked and bioload could be the problem, both of which could be the cause of your fish being sick. Please dont come asking for help and then tell us we are wrong.
I agree with everyone else in saying you need a MUCH larger tank ASAP. You mbu will not live very long in a tank that size. And by your comment that you just moved him to a much larger tank of 150 makes me think the damage may have already been done. What size tank and how long was he in it before?
So yeah, 88 gallon for close to a year.
"Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal." -- Henry Ford
-
Pufferpunk
- Queen Admin
- Posts: 32988
- Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 11:06 am
- Gender: Female
- My Puffers: Puffers I have kept:
T lineatus
T miurus
A modestus
T biocellatus
C valentini
C coranata
C papuan
C lorteti
DPs
suvattii
burrfish
T niphobles - Location (country): USA, Greenville, SC
- Location: Greenville, SC
- Contact:
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
I am concerned that you show no nitrate.
Remember guys--if we attack everyone who comes here for advise by getting on them about tank size right away, before they learn to trust what we are telling them will help, they may leave & never come back. Then, what does that accomplish? How does this help the puffer???
Remember guys--if we attack everyone who comes here for advise by getting on them about tank size right away, before they learn to trust what we are telling them will help, they may leave & never come back. Then, what does that accomplish? How does this help the puffer???
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
-
xrayjeeper83
- Mbu Puffer
- Posts: 4167
- Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 9:31 pm
- Gender: Male
- My Puffers: Fahaka named Bloat
Abei named Huey
GSP named Bacon - Location (country): USA
- Location: Orange Park, FL
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
how long has the 150 been running? what did you do to cycle it?
RTR wrote:Fahakas do not have tank mates, they may have swimming food reserves.
-
sevenyearnight
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
+1Pufferpunk wrote:I am concerned that you show no nitrate.
Remember guys--if we attack everyone who comes here for advise by getting on them about tank size right away, before they learn to trust what we are telling them will help, they may leave & never come back. Then, what does that accomplish? How does this help the puffer???
-
Mikeyburnsey
- Puffer Fry
- Posts: 46
- Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2010 5:33 am
- Gender: Male
- My Puffers: I own A MBU, bought 13th July 2010, it is called Midge. Housed in a 88 Gallon Tank External Filter Ehiem Pro 3. HMA water system, Blue and white lights for night and day. 2 Heaters.
- Location (country): Redruth Cornwall UK
- Location: Redruth Cornwall England
- Contact:
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
I have read all the points, and one I am not rude I have kept all sort of fish for over 25 years, so now people are telling me my readings are wrong, I know how to use test kits my number 3 requires 10 drops then shake the 2nd bottle requires to be shaken first for 30 seconds then 10 drops shake the test tube for 1 minute and then wait for 5 minutes look at colour compare to chart, now that I have wasted 5 minutes in explaining how to use a test tube, like what your admin says is very true I got blasted last year and I did not come back or post comments until now!!!!!
I want advice on my sick puffer I don't understand all the negativity I will post my concerns at a later date.
Today I going to up load photos of the tank also move Midge to a smaller tank so I can treat him and not the tank, I will also update salt readings and do another test on the water, I will ring the vets and seek further advice, but I feel it might be all in vain, Thanks to all the positive feedback Mike
I want advice on my sick puffer I don't understand all the negativity I will post my concerns at a later date.
Today I going to up load photos of the tank also move Midge to a smaller tank so I can treat him and not the tank, I will also update salt readings and do another test on the water, I will ring the vets and seek further advice, but I feel it might be all in vain, Thanks to all the positive feedback Mike
I take on advice, but refuse to be bullied by those who think they are in control!! Mikey
-
bertie 83
- Moderator
- Posts: 5298
- Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:28 pm
- Gender: Male
- My Puffers: lineatus R.I.P, South American puffer. Valentini puffer, porcupine puffer.
Non puffer
Danios, Tetras, Redtail Rasporas,
Harlequins, CAE's, Yoyo
Loaches, Clown loaches ,Eels, various shrimp, tangs,wrasses, damsels, chromis - Location (country): Brighton, England
- Location: brighton , england
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
Maybe trapped air? There is obviously more than 1 problem here tho, melafix should clear up the eye and perhaps trapped air is putting him at an angle. So first off have a go at burping and add melafix to try to make him feel better, do any of the pro's think this is worth a try? Then we could work out what the underlying problem is,
It's amazing how easy maintenance is. If done regularly and thoroughly
-
Pufferpunk
- Queen Admin
- Posts: 32988
- Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 11:06 am
- Gender: Female
- My Puffers: Puffers I have kept:
T lineatus
T miurus
A modestus
T biocellatus
C valentini
C coranata
C papuan
C lorteti
DPs
suvattii
burrfish
T niphobles - Location (country): USA, Greenville, SC
- Location: Greenville, SC
- Contact:
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
Since you are a long-time fishkeeper, do you understand why we question the lack of nitrate in your tank? How big is the puffer now? Why are you adding any salt at all to a FW tank? Please read: library/water-filtration/thesaltoftheearth/
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
-
jus85411
- Mbu Puffer
- Posts: 1116
- Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:28 pm
- Gender: Male
- My Puffers: none currently :(
- Location (country): USA
- Location: Philadelphia Area
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
mike i agree with everyone about the stocking and such, but i wont blast you in anyway for it because mostly everyone has already. i have a bad feeling the puffer may have been put in too small of a tank for too long and possibly stunted. a year is a long time in a tank that is 10x less than recommended, fahakas are supposed to grow an inch/month for the first year. that is a healthy growth rate, something a mbu probably wouldnt be able to do in such a small tank
a lot of times people will "upgrade as necessary" which is a perfect equation for stunting, im not implying these were your thoughts upon purchase as i dont know those things. but when putting fish(especially puffs) in a setup its highly recommended that they are put in their adult tank, if not close to it. everyone here wants to see you succeed with your mbu and see a recovery from the fish, its why they come to the forum, to try and help people who have problems/questions. some responses come off really strong though only because this is their passion.
your discus should be in a separate tank, i have heard they produce a larger bioload than puffs and need different water conditions. not to mention mbu's are a puff, so i wouldnt keep anything you care too much for with them as it can just turn around one day and decide it doesnt want anything with it in the tank.
no one was questioning your practices or your knowledge in testing your water. they were curious as to what type of test kits you were using, whether it be liquid or strips because strips are not worth anyones time. but you have answered that with liquid as you broke down how you test.
moving the puff at this point might cause more harm than good, its just added stress from being handled as well as being put in a smaller home again. do you run carbon in your tank? also how did you cycle the 150 before you put the puff in? how long has it been in the larger tank?
but like others said, please keep an open mind to suggestions given here and dont get so defensive. its a forum with very very knowledgeable people on puffers specifically, keeping them for years and studying them for years. they know whats best, period. i had a GSP that would have been doomed from the start. pufferpunk found me on another forum asking about them and sent me here, i havent gone to another fish forum ever. for puffs, tropical/marine fish i ask questions here because i trust the people here. their knowledge goes so far beyond puffers.
sorry this is a book i wrote, just trying to help a little bit and get your morale about this place up. were here to help you, not bash or talk down to you about you keeping fish. we can only make suggestions to help, from there you do what you want. just try not to get too worked up if we say something about the stocking or levels
a lot of times people will "upgrade as necessary" which is a perfect equation for stunting, im not implying these were your thoughts upon purchase as i dont know those things. but when putting fish(especially puffs) in a setup its highly recommended that they are put in their adult tank, if not close to it. everyone here wants to see you succeed with your mbu and see a recovery from the fish, its why they come to the forum, to try and help people who have problems/questions. some responses come off really strong though only because this is their passion.
your discus should be in a separate tank, i have heard they produce a larger bioload than puffs and need different water conditions. not to mention mbu's are a puff, so i wouldnt keep anything you care too much for with them as it can just turn around one day and decide it doesnt want anything with it in the tank.
no one was questioning your practices or your knowledge in testing your water. they were curious as to what type of test kits you were using, whether it be liquid or strips because strips are not worth anyones time. but you have answered that with liquid as you broke down how you test.
moving the puff at this point might cause more harm than good, its just added stress from being handled as well as being put in a smaller home again. do you run carbon in your tank? also how did you cycle the 150 before you put the puff in? how long has it been in the larger tank?
but like others said, please keep an open mind to suggestions given here and dont get so defensive. its a forum with very very knowledgeable people on puffers specifically, keeping them for years and studying them for years. they know whats best, period. i had a GSP that would have been doomed from the start. pufferpunk found me on another forum asking about them and sent me here, i havent gone to another fish forum ever. for puffs, tropical/marine fish i ask questions here because i trust the people here. their knowledge goes so far beyond puffers.
sorry this is a book i wrote, just trying to help a little bit and get your morale about this place up. were here to help you, not bash or talk down to you about you keeping fish. we can only make suggestions to help, from there you do what you want. just try not to get too worked up if we say something about the stocking or levels
-
sevenyearnight
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
And to add on to jus85411's well said statement, I'd like to also ask, if you are defensive about every question asked, and maybe even don't answer some, how are we supposed to help? What do you expect us to say? Seriously, though, what are you expecting from us? Trouble shooting is effectively asking questions to determine the problem. If the problem is unknown, then questions need to be asked, if they go unanswered, there is no way to rule anything out.
Also, this hobby is a science, and science is not a constant. We would be in a very bad way if new discoveries and new truths were never made. We cannot go about this hobby as if the science involved is a constant. Many practices that were considered acceptable 25 years ago have since been proven many times over as false, some things are simply unnecessary,
unfortunately something are harmful, even fatal.
Also, this hobby is a science, and science is not a constant. We would be in a very bad way if new discoveries and new truths were never made. We cannot go about this hobby as if the science involved is a constant. Many practices that were considered acceptable 25 years ago have since been proven many times over as false, some things are simply unnecessary,
unfortunately something are harmful, even fatal.
Last edited by sevenyearnight on Fri Jul 15, 2011 6:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
Nuclear_Glitter
- Fahaka Puffer
- Posts: 971
- Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 1:03 am
- Gender: Female
- Location (country): North Carolina, USA
- Location: North Carolina, USA
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
We're really not trying to flame you or shove the tank size down your throat, we just are trying to help you.
If you could please answer the questions that have been asked of you we could all help you much more.
What's exactly everything he eats, how much and how often?
What do you add to the water? How much, how often, exact names and brands.
What sort of salt are you using? How much, how often?
How exactly did you cycle the tank?
Also any other information that you think could be helpful in the healing of your puffer.
Please answer all the questions as we would love to help your puffer and see some healthy pics of him once he's better. =]
If you could please answer the questions that have been asked of you we could all help you much more.
What's exactly everything he eats, how much and how often?
What do you add to the water? How much, how often, exact names and brands.
What sort of salt are you using? How much, how often?
How exactly did you cycle the tank?
Also any other information that you think could be helpful in the healing of your puffer.
Please answer all the questions as we would love to help your puffer and see some healthy pics of him once he's better. =]
"Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal." -- Henry Ford
-
Mikeyburnsey
- Puffer Fry
- Posts: 46
- Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2010 5:33 am
- Gender: Male
- My Puffers: I own A MBU, bought 13th July 2010, it is called Midge. Housed in a 88 Gallon Tank External Filter Ehiem Pro 3. HMA water system, Blue and white lights for night and day. 2 Heaters.
- Location (country): Redruth Cornwall UK
- Location: Redruth Cornwall England
- Contact:
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
TO ALL THE KNOW ALL MIDGE IS DEAD
I take on advice, but refuse to be bullied by those who think they are in control!! Mikey
-
Pufferpunk
- Queen Admin
- Posts: 32988
- Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 11:06 am
- Gender: Female
- My Puffers: Puffers I have kept:
T lineatus
T miurus
A modestus
T biocellatus
C valentini
C coranata
C papuan
C lorteti
DPs
suvattii
burrfish
T niphobles - Location (country): USA, Greenville, SC
- Location: Greenville, SC
- Contact:
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
I'm sorry for your loss. It is of my opinion that something went wrong by keeping it so long in the 88g.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
-
bertie 83
- Moderator
- Posts: 5298
- Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:28 pm
- Gender: Male
- My Puffers: lineatus R.I.P, South American puffer. Valentini puffer, porcupine puffer.
Non puffer
Danios, Tetras, Redtail Rasporas,
Harlequins, CAE's, Yoyo
Loaches, Clown loaches ,Eels, various shrimp, tangs,wrasses, damsels, chromis - Location (country): Brighton, England
- Location: brighton , england
Re: Midge MBU Puffer
sorry to hear this
It's amazing how easy maintenance is. If done regularly and thoroughly