To change water or not to change

[jus85411]

He used to wake up and rub himself all over everything in the tank and he hasn't done that today so maybe we are making progress.

what do you mean by rubbing himself all over everything? was it like he was uncoordinated and accidently running into things? or does it seem more like he goes up to decoration, positions himself and seems to jerk his body real quick as to "scratch an itch"?

[aotto]

No live plants, just a few plastic ones to give them a place to hang out and hide. I'm planning on taking back at least on of the Monos this afternoon. Do you think it would be ok to ask them for some filter media from an established tank or is that a bad idea since they seem to be giving me terrible advice. I'm pretty sure they will say I don't need it and to just "ride out the cycle process."

Also, Stimpy doesn't seem to notice or care much about the few snails I put in there. Guess I should take them out.

[Flutter]

Both the monos need to go back. They're schooling fish and it would be unfair to keep one singly. Plus when your puffer grows up it will probably get terrorized.

You can get some media from them, even dirty gravel will work. However, it will be safer to get the media from a private tank. As you know, don't trust their advice and don't buy any products that they suggest for your water. Prime is all you need. Don't buy processed foods either. You'll be safe with frozen however that can be bought from a grocery store.

[aotto]

Jus85411 - he would swim around and rub his body on stuff as if it felt good or scratched an itch.

True about it being unfair to keep the one Mono. Guess I need to just focus on my little puffer for now. He seems pretty happy since the WC today. I tested the water for ammonia and it seems to be down ever so slightly. Still turning green in the test tube but not nearly as dark. Slowly but surely I hope. I will do another WC tonight (maybe a 25%) or a big 50% tomorrow morning. Hopefully he will be happy. He hasn't darkened at all today and is more active. I get nervous when he swims at the surface though. He isn't confused and running into the walls like the other one did before he died though. He seems to be looking up while he swims at the top, maybe at his reflection. He's just hanging out resting now and has been bright green all day.

Let's hope the idiots at the store don't say anything stupid today.

What would I buy at the grocery store to keep as frozen food for them? I can do that today too.

[Flutter]

Look for a seafood medly. That's easiest. Some good foods for puffers are: shell on shrimp, shrimp, squid, octopus, mussels, clams, scallops, etc. You just need to make sure that it is raw and doesn't contain other ingredients like garlic butter

Those are all good foods that can supplement snails. I can't remember, do you have a way to breed snails? Snails are the best and they're nice and crunchy. We have to crush the snails for all of our puffers, if we don't they just bite the easily reachable meat and ignore the rest. We breed shrimp for them too, they're both in a 10gal but with 5 puffers we can't keep up

[aotto]

I don't have a breeding tank for snails but I have told my husband that we should go that route since we will be sure our snails are healthy. I will go find the library article on doing that.

So would the seafood medley be frozen already? Can I buy it fresh and freeze it? As long as it doesn't have other ingredients or say it's precooked right? Stimpy likes the snails. He will bite a hole in their shell and yank them out. I think the small piece he bites is all he eats of the shell though.

So most importantly, should I do another small water change tonight or wait and do a 50% tomorrow? I don't like him at the surface as much as he is and I probably can't get any old filter media until tomorrow from my mom's tank.

[Flutter]

Around here it's already frozen. You can buy fresh and freeze it as well.

Yep, you're right. Just make sure that it's just frozen food

To be honest, you can't do too many water changes to get rid of ammonia and nitrite. Feel free to do a 75% tonight and tomorrow You don't have to worry about doing too many and the larger they are the more bad stuff they'll remove. Once you get some media you won't have to do so many. Keep an eye on the parameters and do water changes if you're showing ammonia and/or nitrite (this is on top of weekly changes).

[jmiller]

When I had a filter crash and had to emergency cycle a tank I was doing 50% water changes twice a day.

My snail breeding tank is only 5.5 gallon and that's plenty for one GSP.

[aotto]

OK. I talked to my mom and her freshwater tank has a different type of filter than mine. She has one that hangs on the back and it takes "little white bags with charcoal in them." She does water changes about once a month and rinses the filters out and put them back???? Does that sound right? She has been taking the advice of the same fish store that has been telling me wrong but her tank has leveled out and done well.

[purplecandle]

OK. I talked to my mom and her freshwater tank has a different type of filter than mine. She has one that hangs on the back and it takes "little white bags with charcoal in them." She does water changes about once a month and rinses the filters out and put them back???? Does that sound right? She has been taking the advice of the same fish store that has been telling me wrong but her tank has leveled out and done well.

She probably needs to do more water changes.

And yes, rinsing them out and putting them bag is good as long as she rinses with water the same temp at the tank. The bag has most of her bacteria if she where to rinse with hot water she would lose the bacteria.

[aotto]

So I guess I could take one of those bags from her and put it in my filter area to help setup the good bacteria?

I did a 50% wc this morning and Stimpy seemed happier but now he's spending most of his time at the surface just like the other one did before he died. This is why I'm so confused. If I don't do anything and ride out the cycle process like the fish store said then the ammonia will be so high he will die. At the same time, I do water changes to help them and the next day they die. I'm using Prime (enough of it) and water the same temp as the tank. They seem happy at first and then they start swimming at the surface and are gone the next day. It's like nobody's advice works and I am doomed to have no puffers. I can't find BioSpira or Dr. Tom"s around here either and my mom's house is a good hour there and back at rush hour traffic time.

[Flutter]

The water changes aren't causing death, the toxins are. The more you do the better. That's why they look happier after the water change. You can add extra prime, I think it helps with ammonia at about 5x the normal dose. Someone would need to confirm that though.

Do another water change tonight, 50%+, get the dirty media tomorrow if you can, and things should start looking up. You're working hard, learning a lot, and you're almost there. Things will be easier with the monos gone. Once they leave I'd do a large water change, 80% maybe to help improve water quality. It will be easier to control with fewer fish. I know it's really hard but you're heading in the right direction and soon it'll be worth it.

[aotto]

I'm assuming I should NOT change the carbon filter cartridge when I water change since the good bacteria is trying to grow in there and the bio wheel. Right??

[Flutter]

Right, leave your media alone. Don't even rinse it. Once the tank is cycled you can take out the carbon because it really isn't necessary. It's useful for removing medication from water and such but in a normal tank it isn't needed.

[aotto]

Ok. I'm sending the husband back to the store with the two Monos and having him ask them if they carry Bio Spira or Dr. Tims. If not maybe they will give him some old filter media. Who knows though since they seem to think "riding it out" is the way to go. I am going to start another water change while he's gone and hopefully we can save our little guy. I just can't imagine what's making the ammonia stay so high with half the water being changed out and them not eating since the water change. There is only three fish in there and the ammonia is just so high. Hopefully the damage to the puffer isn't too bad to be reversed.

Could it be anything else causing his behavior? He is gray on his belly and just hovering around the surface. If he sees me at the glass he will swim around and not seem confused but he comes right back to the surface and resumes his head up surface skimming.