Newb looking for info

[duds]

I have kept freshwater tanks for about five years now but have never kept a puffer. It will be a bit before i expand my borders beyond cichlids (maybe as long as two years), but I figure it's never too early to grab information. If I stay with freshwater I plan on going with dwarf puffers, if I go brackish I'm leaning towards figure 8. I'd like a species that is fairly bold and interactive.

Does anyone have links or tips regarding:
- caring for a brackish tank
- raising food for puffers (I'm thinking cherry/ghost shrimp and snails)
- suitable tankmates for either of the two species mentioned above
- aquascaping for puffers (specifically dwarf or f8)
- any recommendations for a first puffer species (keeping in mind aquariums are not a new thing for me)
- anything else that might be helpful?

I'm fairly well versed on general aquaria things like cycling a tank and other tank chemistry (except for salinity).
Hopefully this thread is in the right place.
Thanks in advance!

[duds]

One more thing... the tank I intend to use is a 75 gallon (48"x18" footprint) with plenty of filtration... water turnover is a bit more than 10x/hr supplied by two HOBs. Another question I should ask is how many puffers (f8 or dwarf) could I keep in this tank?

[RTR]

A 75 will house 4 or 5 F-8s. It is best to get them all at once if possible - introducing new stock to an existing and established tank can be iffy.

The setup needs to be visually complex - F-8s are hunter-predators and scan their surrondings all but constantly for food items. Rockwork, artificial mangrove roots. artificial plants, etc. can be arrange to interrupt the lines of sight through the tank and maximize surfaces for the fish to explore. Somewhat sheltered overhangs will provide resting or napping or sleeping areas for the individual fish, preferably out of direct or full sight of its tank mate's resting areas.

Very small fish (<1") may be fed 6 days a week. From half-grown onwards, alternate-day feeding is fine. All feeding is to a lighted rounded belly - grossly stuffed bellies are over-feeding - not good for the fish or the water quality. Puffers are quite unlike Cichids and most other fish in internal structure - they have no ribs, so food in the gut is easily observed.

The water should be light brackish, best about 1.003 specific gravity, and high water quality is always needed. Plan on 50% partials weekly, more if you over-feed. Their incisor plates (fused teeth) grow constantly (like rodents) so they need a crunchy diet to wear down those dental plates. Mollusks and shellfish and shell-on shrimp are good food items. My f-8s get a diet 90-95% owner-raised snails which are fed well with high-veggie diet in good quality water. The rest of the diet would be fishmarket small shellfish or owner-raised shrimp for me.

With good water quality and diets, these - like many cichlids - are long-lived fish and should average about 15 years in your care.

Unfortunately they have not yet been captive bred.

There are multiple articles here in the Library and notes in the PufferPedia on puffer care and feeding.

HTH

[Pufferpunk]

Great thing you're doing research!

Since you have 2 years, start reading our Library articles. Fantastic info there!

[Flutter]

F8's are lovely puffers. We have one and she's our favourite. You won't regret getting them and you may regret waiting so long Keep a presence over here and you'll learn a lot. By the time you're ready to get them you'll be perfectly prepared

[duds]

RTR, thanks for the in depth reply. A couple questions about the snails:
- can I raise snails in a freshwater tank and then throw them into the puffers brackish tank?
- is there a specific species of snail that is easy to breed and nutritious for the puffers?
- what size of tank should I use for a combo of snails and cherry shrimp in order to keep my puffers constantly fed (assuming I have 4-5 f8s)

I've read of few of the library articles on brackish tanks and puffer profiles. This is a very helpful site. Thanks to all for their input!

[Hilly]

Ramshorn snalils are the preferred snail of choice for feeding as they breed rapidly. If you have a smaller unused tank that you can set up specifically for snail breeding that should give you the optimum yield for a cheap renewable source of food. FIlter it, a good high temperature, add a calcium supplement so their shells have some crunch and away you go. I have never kept shrimp so someone else can answer the success of a combo snail\shrimp tank.

you can raise freshwater snails and use them to feed a brackish puffer, they wont last very long with a hungry puffer.

[duds]

I'm beginning to lean towards the f8 puffer... what does their natural environment look like? I'm picturing a tank setup with a DIY background to look a bit cave-like with a few plants, java-fern and moss, dark 'cave' walls and rocks to bring out the colors of the fish... is that anything like their home turf?

After reading up a bit on keeping groups of puffers together I'm thinking I will understock the tank (75g) a bit, so instead of 4-5 puffers i might do 2-3. I prefer a happy tank to a full tank. Any thoughts on this? Any non-puffer tankmates that would work in this? One thing that would be neat is if there is a type of shrimp that could thrive and breed in brackish water so that there would be a renewable food-source right in the tank as well as giving more activity. Is this possible? Would the puffers over-eat?

[Pufferpunk]

a combo of snails and cherry shrimp

Shrimp have been known to eat snail eggs.

[Flutter]

Cherry shrimp can do fine in the brackish water however they won't do well with puffers in there too

[duds]

Cherry shrimp can do fine in the brackish water however they won't do well with puffers in there too

I was afraid of that. Is there any way to 'scape the tank that would give the shrimp a chance to survive? Low rock ledges or tight little caves? It would be very convenient if I could leave home for a week without needing to arrange for someone feed my fish.

[Flutter]

I don't think so. We have a ton of tight spaces in with our F8 and she goes through shrimp like nobody's business.

However, if you do go away for a week no one needs to feed them. If you make your tank very complex then you can drop a bunch of shrimp in in the dark and hopefully they'll last a couple days.

You can see the rock work in this thread. She never stops looking for food unless she's sleeping or begging. She doesn't pace at all thankfully but she's always on the hunt. She is just wonderful.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=23856&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=feight

[duds]

Ok, looks like the shrimp-in-tank idea won't work.
By the way Flutter, cute little beast you have.

[RTR]

Many many folk try rearing food and fish together. It does nor work.

Breeding snails is easy, as noted before. rearing red cherry shrimp is also easy. Common pond and ramshorn snails are pretty standard, but ramshorns are the best food IMHO, but are not as productive as common pond snails. Red cherry shrimp are decent food also. All these critters will do okay short-term in the light BW for F-8s, but to make your life easiest, rear them in FW. Use many more snails than the small shrimp - the shells of the snails are better for maintaining the dental plates.

[duds]

I will likely raise both ramshorn snails and cherry shrimp... the shrimp tank I plan to decorate and make it a bit of a show tank as well as being a place to raise food. What would be a good size for each tank?