Hello from NYC!

[GSP_Junior]

Hi there new forum friends!

Greetings from New York City!
I hope to get some advice on this site as well as offer some advice from my experience and experiments.
My wife and I have a lovely dog, a well planted tropical freshwater tank that has a beautiful angelfish named Mary Jane, two neon tettras, blue gourami, blue ram, mystery snail, zebra snail, algea eater (that i havent seen in a week ), and a whole bunch of algea eating shrimp (which become food for our GSP).

And our other tank is currently a GSP only tank with crushed coral substrate, tufa rock which is now growing some beautiful neon green corraline algea, and a SG of apx 1.021.

We started our GSP in our freshwater tank to see how it would do, and as expected, in the matter of one night, was taken over by our tiny baby GSP! All of the shrimp were huddled up under a piece of drift wood in a ditch they dug in the sand substrate. The fish were kind of hiding out low in the tank plants which was not normal, and lastly a happy GSP buzzing around the whole tank! I knew he had to be moved.
So I then setup an old tank (only a 5g, it was all i had laying around). Fortunately i run dual 30g aqua clear filters on my freshwater, so i used that to quickly cycle the new fresh water tank for Junior, our GSP. It cycled in about a day from the mature bacteria in my filter and from the small 5g tank. Junior was then happily moved to his new home with the live rock inspired aqua-scaping of the tufa rock and crushed coral knowing i was going to covert to full marine in due time.
We have had Junior for about a month now and he has been pretty happy in the 5g, but I know he wants more space. For now, he is pleased with the steady diet live gut loaded shrimp and freeze dried shrimp and snail shells.
As soon as we clear the space from where our Christmas tree is, we will start to setup a 20g long tank with a SG of 1.021-1.025 and plenty of live rock and live sand and crushed coral.
I figure that will take about a month to cycle and then Junior will have his new home.

For the new tank, I have done EXTENSIVE research on salt water tanks so i feel i have a good knowledge base to get it going.
My theory in a happy tank is filtration filtration filtration! and water changes of course.
All our fish are very happy. I have had fish my whole live and consider myself a science nerd, and i do find measuring and charting all the water parameters very exciting! There is something to be said for the reward of sustaining a life and a natural environment and habitat.

I can gladly report that Junior is very happy in full marine conditions. He is a very fascinating fish.

My debate on what filtration to use on the 20g tank is basically what direction to go with it!?
I believe i will go with an aquaclear 30 for filtering and keeping junk out of the water, and plan to use the foam to filter and activated carbon to keep water clear.

Next for filtration will be a Aqua clear 50 with the only media being live sand and pieces of live rock.

Next will be a hang on back protein skimmer. Not sure if i will do a stand alone protein skimmer, or one that is built into a HOB refugium. thoughts and experiences here are very welcome!

The live rock in tank and filter/refugium will take care of biological filtration.

and last a powerhead or two for water movement.

Any thoughts or comments are welcome and I look forward to being a member of this very neat and niche community of GSP lovers!

Edward

[purplecandle]

Welcome!! Quite an introduction!

A 20 gallon is not enough for a GSP. 30 gallons is the Minimum, but a better choice is a 40-55. Imagine a nerf football in a 20 gallon..

He needs to come out of the 5 gallon as soon as possible (can't wait a month)..no matter the filtration a 5 cannot keep up with the bioload a GSP (even a juvenile).

[GSP_Junior]

Well thank you!
I am well aware that he/she needs out of the 5g. and believe me i am working on it.
i thought about getting an oceanic biocube 29, but have read mixed reviews on them.

So i think i will likely go with either to 20g long to give extra room to swim back and forth. The 29g is the same base size and will fit the same stand so i have considered this as well.
My question here would be, what is the diff between a 20 and 29, maintenance wise and happiness wise for my fish? Will it be substantial or minimal. More or less, will the effort of maintenance and cost of a 29 outweigh the savings of a 20g long?

I believe he will be fine in the 5g for a month since i do water changes 1-2 times per week and my ammonia, nitrate and nitrate levels are all perfect.
If i did not have to cycle the tank, i would have a new home for him much sooner! but i need to make sure i do this right and don't rush into getting a shoddy setup for the new home and instead setup a nice new fresh tank that he will be happy in and will also sustain itself to an acceptable level with my due diligence.

[purplecandle]

Generally we advise that it is better to be in a large uncycled tank than to be in a 5 gallon cycled tank. You seem willing to stay up on water changes...it would be better for the fish in a large tank that is cycling if you are willing to do the water changes...think.."the key to pollution is dilution"

Yes a 20 long is more length room to move...but you must consider the water volume. the more volume the better, these guys put out a lot. I would say almost as much as a goldfish. So more water volume is better than length. However, they are back and forth swimmers so a cube is not ideal.

29 gallons is one gallon short of the minimum, which will work for a while. But, I promise he will out grow it. I keep 2 per 55 and it is not enough room..it just isn't.

As far as maintenance costs you main costs will be salt. So at full marine will probably work out to be cheaper than brackish. And in general the larger the tank the easier it is to maintain at marine.

If I were you I would go on craigslist and find a 55 with stand for cheap ($150) and then build a SW tank out of it..or buy a used marine tank, however, on craigslist those are often over priced.

[Pufferpunk]

Generally we advise that it is better to be in a large uncycled tank than to be in a 5 gallon cycled tank.

That means now!!!

[Lil' Swimz$]

Hey there!

Would it work to keep the puffer in the angel tank witht he shrimp taken out and put in the 5 gallon, and maybe the tetras, I'm sure the angel could hold its ground don't you think?

That way it could spend its time waiting for a larger tank in a big tank that's cycled.

I have never kept a GSP, but one whole gallon too little doesn't seem like it will matter.

[Pufferpunk]

I would never place a puffer with a long-finned fish like an angel.

[Lil' Swimz$]

Not even if they were larger and lots of cover?

[Pufferpunk]

Nope, a puffer will rip chunks of fins from any sized fish. Especially a slow-moving one.

[Lil' Swimz$]

Oooh I see. Note taken, PP

[GSP_Junior]

Glad to report the puffer (Junior) and angel fish (Mary Jane) did not seem to cross paths their one night in existence together.
So no fin nipping. The shrimp were the first targets of Junior before he got relocated.

I cant do any tank switching now because the Angel tank is low PH tropical FW and Junior is in marine (1.021).

[kingkoopa]

Hello!! Nice to see a fellow member from NYC as well. =) I too have a small tank (15g) that i want to upgrade to a 20-30g tank. I wish I could have space for me, and I know it is not even close to an excuse, but I wish NYC apartments were MUCH bigger!

[GSP_Junior]

Hello!! Nice to see a fellow member from NYC as well. =) I too have a small tank (15g) that i want to upgrade to a 20-30g tank. I wish I could have space for me, and I know it is not even close to an excuse, but I wish NYC apartments were MUCH bigger!

I feel you pain kingkoopa. We pay too much for too little here in NYC. A 55G would be great! but i have no room for that what so ever.
I am glad to report that Junior is doing great in the 5g for now. It has been about 2 1/2 months. I have tufa rock, some coral rock i found in the water in Ft Lauderdale (brought home) and a chunk of real good purple coralline algea from the LFS. I crushed up a piece of the purple coralline and i have purple stuff growing all over my rock! It is great!
I also have two hermit crabs and a Mexican turbo snail.
Contrary to what most everyone is saying on GSPs; i have successfully maintained 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 0 nitrate with a PH of 8-8.2 and SG of 1.022-1.026. about a 50% water change every 1-2 weeks.

In a few weeks, i will be buying my 29g to setup as a moderate reef tank, mostly just live rock with perhaps a coral or two (brain or mushrooms), and plan to throw a bunch of hermit crabs, few more turbo snails, and possibly some Nertie snails.
I may toss one of those little reef fish in that burrows in the sand to keep it sifted. I expect he will live in the rocks and given the kind nature of my puffer, i don't expect him to bug anyone in the tank.
the hermit crabs crawl all around the rock and tank and Junior is really just interested in the freeze dried shrimp and the occasional algae eating shrimp that i toss in from my freshwater tank which he stalks and devours! it is really awesome to watch him rip the shrimp apart limb by limb.