Fahaka Puffer Blind?!

[busybones]

I think two or three days would be fine. In the wild it's been said that they can go several days without eating. I find it hard to make my puffers skip feeding days but you need to get to the bottom of the problem in case it's something that can cause more problems later. You said the tank is pretty bare as far as decor goes..maybe moving things around will help him if he's just bord. You may want to consider adding more things to his diet and switching things up to keep him interested and to give him more variety.

I also found this but wouldn't take it to the bank. I don't know the person who wrote it and what their experience is..

"It could be any number of things. Infection, aneurysm, tumor, toxin poisoning, internal injury, etc. Internal infection can be treated with "Maracyn Two". It absorbs inside the fish to get where infection is. Other than toxins which can be removed by water changes, the rest are really not treatable.

You might want to change some of the tank water. It will help boost her immunity and will reduce any possible toxins. Replace 25% and have the water tested for the presence of ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates at your local fish store."
-Chris Robbins


However I wouldn't recommend giving your puffer ANY medications without real reason, they can be fatal to them.

[kingFUGU]

If your fish appears blind without any previous trauma or infection to it it's likely caused by excessive lighting or poor nutrition. Dimming the lighting and improving the diet can in these cases help prevent more fish from going blind but will not help the fish that has already gone blind.

I know we've hassled you about your tank size ect but these things can play a factor in your fish's health. Please understand that we are only trying to help and that typed words can come across different than spoken ones.[/quote]

I understand that the tank size may be a factor. I appericate your concern. As far as the light that seems like it could have something to do with my situation, how many hours do you have light on your puffer per day? Also what type of buld/wattage do you use? I am running a hood with a 48in light with 25 watts

[kingFUGU]

[quote="busybones"]I think two or three days would be fine. In the wild it's been said that they can go several days without eating. I find it hard to make my puffers skip feeding days but you need to get to the bottom of the problem in case it's something that can cause more problems later. You said the tank is pretty bare as far as decor goes..maybe moving things around will help him if he's just bord. You may want to consider adding more things to his diet and switching things up to keep him interested and to give him more variety.

I have read a lot that any meds can be very harmful, I am not sure I want to go that route yet but apperiacte the idea and the warning. As far as the set up. It is not totally bare, I have a decent size peice of wood in the right corner, and lots of fake plants surrounding it. I also have a mixture of low lying and and tall fake plants through out the tank (mostly low lying int he middle and higher towards the edges and around the wood. Do you think maybe if I rearranged the set up it may spark some interest or at least see how he reacts?

[busybones]

I run two 40w fluorecent light strips for about 12 hours a day. The tank doesn't get any direct sunlight and sometimes I will turn one light off so he has dim lit side to hangout if he feels the need. I've never really done much research on lighting and it's effects (besides algae ect) I just turn one off sometimes so he has an option of being in the light or not. Kind of how we do snakes to give them a basking spot and a cool spot.

[busybones]

"Do you think maybe if I rearranged the set up it may spark some interest or at least see how he reacts?"

It couldn't hurt, I'm not sure if he's bord or not..Most puffers will pase the glass if they are bord. It's just hard to figure out really. As soon as Pookie sees me walk into the room he's at the glass wanting me to feed him or at least acknowledge that he exist lol Chongo doesn't express any sight at all? I find this very sad I hope he's just giving you the silent treatment and comes out of it...makes me wonder if fish get depressed...i mean my fahaka let's me know when he's angry by going into his hiding spot and turning his back to me. So I know he has some emotions...he pouts like my 5 year old little girl

[kingFUGU]

Busybones-
Ok so I am not that far off on the lighting, The room he is in is dim and no direct sunlight on the tank. I just have the full hood on this tank not the two seperate ones. Might be something to look into for me. Just wondering your thoughts on reagganging the tank to spice up his life a little. Do you think that may help or hurt the situation? Also my light is on a timer so it is on at noon and off at 1am, do you think this is too long too short? Thanks for all of the help!

[eieio]

..........and there may be nothing at all wrong with your puffers' vision
it will probably be the easiest thing to determine
then you can begin to deal with whatever other issues exist
you "won't know until you know"

[kingFUGU]

It couldn't hurt, I'm not sure if he's bord or not..Most puffers will pase the glass if they are bord. It's just hard to figure out really. As soon as Pookie sees me walk into the room he's at the glass wanting me to feed him or at least acknowledge that he exist lol Chongo doesn't express any sight at all? I find this very sad I hope he's just giving you the silent treatment and comes out of it...makes me wonder if fish get depressed...i mean my fahaka let's me know when he's angry by going into his hiding spot and turning his back to me. So I know he has some emotions...he pouts like my 5 year old little girl [/quote]

Looks like you beat me to my last post. I do notice that when he seems upset he goes to the corner behinde the wood with his tail out and will ignore me. I don't see him giving the classic tank pacing up and down the glass at all, he just kinda seems lazy like chill on one side of the tank swim around a litle then sit on the other side of the tank. I will try the re-arrange thing as well as the vision test and see what happens. thanks again!!

[busybones]

forgot to ask....how long has this behavior been going on? and if you can, photos of the set up can be very helpful...

You are very welcome...that's what we're here for!!

[kingFUGU]

[quote="busybones"]forgot to ask....how long has this behavior been going on? and if you can, photos of the set up can be very helpful...

I will see what I can do to get you pics, I will be home later this evening not sure if I can pull off any quality pics with my cell. Behavior has been going on for about 2 months now.

[Dadof4]

It couldn't hurt, I'm not sure if he's bord or not..Most puffers will pase the glass if they are bord. It's just hard to figure out really. As soon as Pookie sees me walk into the room he's at the glass wanting me to feed him or at least acknowledge that he exist lol Chongo doesn't express any sight at all? I find this very sad I hope he's just giving you the silent treatment and comes out of it...makes me wonder if fish get depressed...i mean my fahaka let's me know when he's angry by going into his hiding spot and turning his back to me. So I know he has some emotions...he pouts like my 5 year old little girl

Looks like you beat me to my last post. I do notice that when he seems upset he goes to the corner behinde the wood with his tail out and will ignore me. I don't see him giving the classic tank pacing up and down the glass at all, he just kinda seems lazy like chill on one side of the tank swim around a litle then sit on the other side of the tank. I will try the re-arrange thing as well as the vision test and see what happens. thanks again!!

I'm wondering how much of this is light vs. one very well fed Fahaka. I'm leaning to the "one very well fed Fahaka". At his size and age I'd go to feeding every other day the same amount of food you do now. All my puffers that are in their adult size I feed every other day and then once a month I don't feed them for 4-5 days. Keeps them interested and healthy. Also may want to try quarantining some live food for him and see what happens, possibly a crayfish or two.

[pufferpuggirl]

Busybones-
Ok so I am not that far off on the lighting, The room he is in is dim and no direct sunlight on the tank. I just have the full hood on this tank not the two seperate ones. Might be something to look into for me. Just wondering your thoughts on reagganging the tank to spice up his life a little. Do you think that may help or hurt the situation? Also my light is on a timer so it is on at noon and off at 1am, do you think this is too long too short? Thanks for all of the help!

Well I don't know if it matters at all, maybe it doesn't ... but I try to keep my lighting on as close to how our natural sunlight works, only I leave it on a little later into the evening. I put my lights on at 10am and turn them off at 8pm. Because we have such a huge swing in winter (getting dark at 4pm) and in summer (staying light until nearly 11pm), I like to keep to the times I mentioned, just seems easier. I'm wondering with you having your lights on until 1am, that your puffer doesn't have sufficient "nighttime" darkness, and therefore doesn't get the rest he needs. Now I doubt this has anything to do with your puffers ability to see, but it's just something I was thinking about as I was reading through this post.

I really hope your Fahaka comes out of whatever is ailing him soon. Good luck!

[busybones]

I'm thinking he's just fed well and has gotten lazy. Pookie done this when I first got him, he lost intrest in his food and didn't swim much. Once I started feeding him less often he started to be very active. I feed him every other day and sometimes skip a couple of days (only giving him small blood worms or snails)

[LilGreenPuffer]

So if you followed that gallon/inch rule, you think your puffer would be OK in a 6g tank? That rule is only for 1-2" slim-bodied fish only. I would get your tests done at your LFS to be sure they are correct.

No i do not think he would be fine in a 6 gallon tank. The fish needs room to turn around and swim. I understand that. The USAUL tankmates are Chongo and the Stripped headstander, it used to be the danios would last about 1-2 weeks as he would hunt them out. NOW THAT HE SEEMS BLIND HE IS NOT HUNTING THE WAY HE WAS. That is why I am trying to see if there is anything I can do to help him out.

Just wanted to check - you know its full size, right? About 18"? They should grow an inch per month for the first year of their lives, but the hormone concentration in the water stops that. So your fahaka is probably seriously stunted and will probably never get any bigger.

Fortunately, that means that a bigger tank is probably not necessary anymore. However, you might want to step up on the water changes and do them weekly instead of monthy.

[nmonks]

The aquarium volume issue is important for overall health, but I wouldn't get too sidetracked by it in this case. Aquarium volume is primarily about dilution of metabolic wastes and water chemistry stability. Provided conditions are good in both regards, it's unlikely tank size is the key issue here.

I'd start by reviewing food. For a start, fish get bored with the same old thing. Let your puffer starve for couple of days or a week, and then offer something. If he's healthy, he'll eat whatever you offer. It goes without saying a potentially piscivorous species like this can and will lunge at any tankmates kept with him, so the danios and characin will need rehoming.

I'd also review what foods had been offered. Feeder fish are the commonest source of problems when it comes to delivering internal parasites such as worms, and there are simply no excuses for using them. Cyprinids (goldfish, minnows, barbs, danios, etc.) also contain a lot of fat, and these cause major problems for fish kept in captivity. Dissections of predatory fish that have been fed these types of feeders commonly show unnatural deposits of fat around the internal organs (see for example Bob Fenner's work on lionfish) and there's every reason to assume a connection between this and the premature death of the predatory fish.

But frozen foods are a mixed bag too. While nominally safe in terms of parasites, not all frozen foods are nutritious. Prawns and mussels are very high in thiaminase, and if they're the bulk of a puffer's diet, vitamin B1 deficiency is very probable. Since this deficiency affects the nervous system, it may well manifest itself in behaviours such as listlessness or loss of control. Thiaminase has certainly been implicated in cases of blindness.

Finally, I'd review the environment. Most of the Tetraodon spp. puffers come from rivers and lakes rather than ponds or streams, and they need plenty of oxygen and water current to do well. You might even consider removing the puffer, moving all the rocks around, and then reintroducing the puffer. This would force him to explore his habitat again, and might jolt him out of his lethargy. Do also try placing a mirror next to the aquarium; if he reacts to his own reflection, he obviously isn't blind, and you might even get a little entertainment in the process.

Cheers, Neale