Somethings wrong with Elvis

[edmlfc1]

156G, nitrites 0, amm. 0, nitrates 5-10, ph 8.2
Coralife 225(?) protein skimmer, 55G sump, mag 18 pump, 3-maxijet 1200 powerheads

Tank mates:

Stars & Stripes puffer 10", snowflake eel 12", GSP 3.5", Wrasse 3.5", Lawnmower Blenny 3"

History

I moved my sw tank from a 125 to a 156 about 4 weeks ago. I added more sand for a deep sand bed and put the sand that was in the 125 on top of the new sand. I added more lr from an 8 year old tank that had no signs of disease and never had copper meds used. After the move we lost one of our GSP's. My nitrates shot up to 40 right after the move. I have been doing 50% water changes two-three times a week to get the nitrates down. The nitrates are now 5-10. The 125 had been running for about 16 months before the move. No new fish have been added.

Symptoms:

I noticed white spots only on the fin of my stars puffer about a two weeks ago. He does head dives into the sand at least a few times a day. He's eating well and so are the other fish. I have not noticed any white spots on any other fish. I noticed last week that his color is fading and he has the bloches all over him. The wrasse has also been thrashing on the rocks. ck. I haven't used any sprays in the house, no lotion on my hands, no chemicals around the tanks.

Is it possible that moving the sand over I may have released gases in the new tank? Or is this an adjustment thing? I touched the stars fins to see if the spots would come off thinking it was sand. It did not come off. It also did not feel lumpy.

I'm starting to think that most of the spots is just sand from him trying to sleep in the smaller cave. This morning I got up fed the fish and he ate good. Now he's in a corner breathing heavy nose down. What's going on in my tank?

[edmlfc1]

Had to change computers my old one is about to die. Here are pictures of his fins. The white spots on his body goes away once he starts to swim, which is why I believe it's sand. But the white spots on his fins don't.

[t1gerbee]

i think you may have whitespot... you bought a few new bits of live rock in when you moved the tank didn't you... white spot parasites can 'rest' in the rocks and then infect the new tank..

you could have accidently carried the parasite into your tank.

Alternatively you could have had the white spot parasite in the tank all the time (most tanks do) and the stress of moving, the subsequent spikes etc let to the fish having slightly weakened immune systems and allowing the parasite to take hold, where as previously they were healthy enough to fight it off.

Spots on fins, heavy breathing (ich attacks gills first) and your flashing all suggest it i'm afraid.

You could try just water changing big time so the parameters are perfect, vitamin sosking their foods etc and hope their immune systems are good enough to fight it..

or you're looking at treatments.

[blondenblue]

Sorry to say it, but it looks like SW ich to me, im no expert but i think mine have it too (and thats what mine looked like when i had it before)
I hope someone with more knowledge can come along and say im wrong!

[edmlfc1]

Chong has no spots on him, and the wrasse has no visible spots either. When Elvis was in the corner I could see in his gills and I didn't see any white spots on his gills. I have been treating the tank with vit. c and soaking their food in selcon vitamins. I have beta glucan on order. Other than that I never had to deal with sw ich before. I really don't know where to start as far as treatment goes. I was more worried about his fading color and the bloches he has. Any idea what would cause the bloches?

[edmlfc1]

Btw: the 3rd picture with his nose in the corner, that's sand all over his back.

[blondenblue]

Dont know about the blotches, but i can say from personal experience, not all the fish will show the spots at the same time. i had 1 puffer with a few spots, then a few days later i had a 2 puffers covered in them and a spot or 2 appeared on some of the other fish. I think the preferd way of treatment is hyposalinity in a separate tank (not so easy with big fish). I have had some success with a product called Esha Oodinex (i think) unfortunately i didn't get in there quick enough and couldn't save them all. That product is also ok for inverts.

[t1gerbee]

that's the thing about ich... not every fish gets it... it's all about the fish's ability to fight the parasite..

when i had it my stars had it, my banner had it, but the gsp, the ceylon and the clowns never got it..

this is a good place to start with working out treatment if you end up going down that road...

library/hospital/swich/

I used hypo successfully, and all are well now.


Just about the blotches, when my stars was ill with ich he changed colour alot, he went darker with blotches.. then lightened up again, and did this cntstantly until i'd got rid of the ich..

dunno if that helps or not.

[Sponge bob]

My dad is a fish expert. I asked him what sideburns look like he say Not sure, then i asked him about what the dots look like, he said it looks like ich, he also said it can be anything. there are many forms of virus's that look like ich. Some puffers at my lfs have it. I would treet him with quick cure and sometimes the heaters can kill it. Have you seen any strange behavior of Elvis or brought something new into the tank?

[edmlfc1]

I don't have a qt tank large enough to move Elvis and the other fish into. All I have is a 29 gallon. Way too small for just Elvis. Can I bring the whole tank to hypo? I have seen small brittle stars and at least one biscuit star in there. Other than that I don't think there are many inverts in there. Only what came in with the lr. I know all the lr won't fit into the 29. Any suggestions other than buying another tank?

[Sponge bob]

My dad says it big enough to hold him in there for like a week for QT. If the tank is bigger then a foot and a half long and foot and half wide by one foot-ish tall it can possibly do. What are the Specs. of the 29?

[Sponge bob]

Did the temp. drop at all?

[t1gerbee]

sponge bob... elvis's sideburns are just his markings.. He has those whether he is feeling well or not... that's just the way he looks..

Edmlfc1..

Are you sure all the live rock won't fit in the 29G... it's surprising how much rock you can fit in when it's all packed together... mine all fitted in a 10G which i didn't think it would.

Listen, you may want to poke PP about this, just to get another opinion.. maybe even poke PQ about it.. ?

Hypo is a BIG pain.. and i don't want to advise you do it without some serious second opinions..

Many don't treat ich at all, they say the fish can deal with it themselves as long as their stress factors are kept very low (ie water quality, stable ph, temp etc) and as long as they are fed super good food...

assuming that happens then the fish can fight the parasite and heal themselves..

but i didn't want to take the risk, and i aslo wanted the parasite gone from the tank forever so it could never come back..

so i put all the live rock/ CUC in my 10G Q tank, and over a few days dropped the whole main tank into hypo, by using pure RO buffered to 8.1 Changing the SG so much can crash the pH, so you MUST buffer the change water to keep everything stable...

... i left it there for 8 weeks keeping up the water changes and reducing feeding... as you lose all the good bacteria in the drop and have no live rock in there..

the live rock was kept fish free for 8 weeks to starve the remaining parasite to death..

then slowly began bringing the SG back up on the main tank by using 1.025 SG water to do water changes...

It's a pain, but i now know, as long as i do not add more fish/rocks without quarentining them first, then i am whitespot free forever. (With any luck)

But please get a second, third, forth opinion before doing anything, i don't want elvis's life in my hands.

[edmlfc1]

I posted in marine depot but pq hasn't logged in since 12/12/09. I found this: http://www.nosickfish.com/product_directions.php . It's expensive but it's suppose to be reef safe also. I have about 300lbs of lr. One piece that weighs about 25-30lbs won't even fit into the tank. The tank's not wide enough. I'll wait for pufferpunk and see what she says before I do anything drastic. I have read on pufferqueens post to use beta glucan to boost their immne system. I have it on order and it should be here in a few days.

[Sponge bob]

Certain Chemicals will kill the live rock and inverts. Even if the tank is small..You still need to QT with No live rock. Just a filter with no carbon bc the carbon takes away the chemicals/meds. You still need to know what your treating. It can go away by it self. It can not. My dad suggest to peak around the LFS and Book stores for books that tell you about sick fish.