My GSP is Sick

[kb1100]

My GSP that I have had for 8 weeks now is all of the sudden acting funny. I had him in a 20 gallon tank with a small mono. Last week the puffer started nipping the mono all of the sudden and it progressed to his death this past Sunday. After the mono died though the puffer started acting funny only swimming directly above the mono. After I removed the mono he seemed very out of place. Normally always active and swimming around, he started just laying on the bottom. When I shut the lite off he seemed even more agitated, and this morning I found him sitting on top of a plant with his side being sucked into the filter. I shut the filter off and he has been moving around only to lay somewhere else though. He definitely seems weak as he couldn't get away from the filter. I also notice lots of very tiny white spots all over behind his eyes near his gills and pretty much every where else on his body. Please help, here are the stats:

1. ph: 8, ammonia: don't have a test kit, nitrite: 0, nitrates: 20, salinity: 1.014
2. 20, used to be a mono and a gsp
3. Feeding once a day. I have been changing every 2 weeks, and I just changed the water Monday night. I have only added instant ocean, nothing else since the start of the tank.
4. The changes inside the tank have been listed if they are considered changes. The only other thing that has happened different is I fed him a snail on Sunday, and I added a new heater on Sunday.
5. The tank has been setup for at least ten weeks, and the fish have been in it for 8 weeks. The tank was cycled with the fishless cycling info. I did use a filter squeeze from the fish store as well.

[Pufferpunk]

Bring some water to your LFS for testing again & do another 50% WC.

[kb1100]

Ok.

Is there a reason to bring the water to the pet store to be tested as apposed to me doing it? Also do you think it is ich?

Thanks for the quick help!

[Jase]

well were the white spots just on his body, or on his fins too?

You should get your LFS to double check, just so you know your tests are still good. (they can expire)
also, they can test for Ammonia. most likely won't have any though if it's an established tank with nitrates like you say.

EDIT:
A 50% water change should be done as soon as possible though. It can only help.

[kb1100]

I will do a water change.

I have noticed now tiny white spots on his side fins and on his gills.

[Pufferpunk]

Read the ich article in our Library.

[kb1100]

Read the ich article in our Library.

I have. Just wasn't positive if it was ich. Hes not moving just laying down so its hard to judge anything.

[Pufferpunk]

Yeah... poor fella doesn't feel well.

[Agnate]

Sounds like he has a strong case of ich, especially if he's been sucked into the filter intake already. Judging by the fact that he has this ich, my guess would be that it's the SW version, as I believe that freshwater ich can't live in saltwater.

You should read up on the hyposalinity treatment method (reducing the salinity to exactly 1.009 SG), as well as doing freshwater baths to help dislodge the ich parasites from his gills.

Kelly (Puffer Queen) has an excellent run-through of SW ich (click here). There's also a good post here about someone trying to combat ich, and Kelly makes many useful suggestions.

FW dips really should be at least 15 minutes but 30 is preferred. I like to add methylene blue to my FW baths.

SeaChem Cupramine is tolerated by even the most sensitive fish. I would recommend treating with this form of copper in a bare bottom tank with no porous materials - rock, etc. Make sure to have an established biological filter and the appropriate test kit for this type of copper - Seachem, Salifert or Red Sea.

Follow the directions on the bottle.

[kb1100]

Thanks everyone for the help.

I went and bought CopperSafe and read all of the articles recommended. Just wondering about best practice though.

If I put him in a separate tank and lower the salinity this will kill the ich. Should I also use CopperSafe with this?
Or would there be a downside to just treating with CopperSafe in the regular tank?

[Pufferpunk]

Copper is ONLY used in severe cases, as a last resort & in an empty quarrantine tank. The copper is very toxic & needs to be monitered VERY CAREFULLY. It will leech into everything porous, making it difficult to keep proper levels of the med & can leech out of the materials (rock/sand), causing an overdose, even after the copper is removed.

[kb1100]

Alright.

But I am inexperienced here and I keep reading things, and don't know what I should do.

I have a hydrometer so it will be hard to get the water to exactly 1.009, so I am taking a risk with that.
I have also read what you just told me about the copper, so I am taking a risk with that.

But he hasn't moved all day and I don't know whats best.

[Pufferpunk]

When you hypo the fish, this also must be done in QT, not the main tank or you will crash the biological system. Are you sure the fish has ich/crypt? Maybe a pic of the spots would help.

[kb1100]

I understand that hypo must be done in a separate tank. It seems like it must be ich to me its all over his body his fins now and even on his eye. Its lake a fine white powder that is stock all over his body even in his gill. There is one spot in particular behind his eye that its like lustered together at.

I took a picture but its dark here and i couldnt get to close to the tank or zoom in with a flash. You cant really even see it in the picture Im not sure why.
http://img253.imagevenue.com/img.php?im ... _206lo.JPG

If guys could advise me the best way to go though that would be great.

[Pufferpunk]

Ich/crypt doesn't look like a fine white powder, it looks like salt has been shaken all over it. Maybe it's velvet?

(Awww... he looks so sad...)