Puffer Behavior

[Happy_Puffer]

I have a GSP and a F8 puffer and they love each other, my tank is very happy and active... most of the time. I have noticed that my GSP is starting to act weird or normal? hee hee. He changes color a lot more now, he doesn't seem to eat as much and when I turn the tank light on he looks near death and then after a while he comes around and starts to move and "dance". Then after he is done with that he goes and hides in my plants. I don't know what is going on with him. The only thing I have changed is I got a new plant (live) for them to eat on. I checked all my levels and they look good except my ph which I am working very hard to fix. If anyone has any advise help help me. I love my puffers and I hate to see them unhappy or sick, and I really don't want to see them die!
Thanks for any help!

[Agnate]

What is your pH at, and what is "wrong" with it? Whatever you do, do NOT use chemicals to raise/lower you pH, as it will most likely kill your fish. Believe it or not, you don't need an "exact" pH for fish to be happy. In fact a constantly-changing pH is a LOT worse for your puffers than a slightly lower/higher one.

Soooo, here's the onslaught of questions you get to answer:

1) Do you put marine salt into the tank? If so, how much?
1b) If you don't use marine salt, then you get to start! Have you ever had saltwater/brackish tanks before?
2) How big are your two puffers?
3) What size of fish tank are you keeping them in?
4) Do you have a second fish tank? If not, get your wallet out, because you're going to need one (as GSPs and F8s aren't really compatible in their water conditions). F8s will stay at a salinity (salt level) of about 1.005 SG (Specific Gravity), whereas GSPs go to high-end brackish or marine (which is 1.016-1.023 SG), meaning that you won't be able to keep them in the same tank.
5) Have you read through any of the Pufferpedia articles on your two types of fish? If not, you should have a look, as there is a lot of good information there.
6) What are the toxin levels in your tank (ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate)? Any ammonia or nitrite readings above 0 means that the puffers are being exposed to deadly toxins. Any nitrate reading about 10 ppm means you need to do a water change to remove some (nothing too major, as this is always the case when there are more than 10 ppm nitrates in a freshwater/brackish tank).

My puffers can get a bit skittish at times, too. If their bellies are white, then I don't think there's anything incredibly wrong (especially if they're still moving around and coming to the glass). However, a decreased appetite might be an issue (as puffers tend to eat as much as they possibly can, regardless of how fat they are).

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but you're going to have to separate your GSP and F8 at some point. There's a very high chance that your GSP will start to pick on the F8 (as the F8 is pretty docile compared to every other puffer), and with their requirements being completely different, you're going to run into health issues if they remain in the same tank.

I'm sure I've forgotten something, but someone else will pipe up, I'm sure.

[zombiefetus]

You'll need to split those puffers up very soon, they are not compatible.
How big is the tank? It sounds like your GSP is very stressed, which could be from a number of things, answer Agnate's questions to give us a better idea of what your tank is like.
Also- What other tank mates are in there? Was the tank cycled? How long has the tank been set up? How much decor do you have, puffers need tons of plants/rocks/caves.

[Happy_Puffer]

I have a 14 gallon tank. I have lots of plants and yes I do have other fish in the tank, but everyone gets along. I have a bumblebee goby, and some glow fish and a few alge eaters. My F8 puffer is meaner then my GSP. I have talked to many people including the person I bought the fish from and she said that my puffers will be good with each other. I have another tank but my chilid is very mean and big and I can't use the tank for now. My levels are all good and I haven't done anything yet to change the ph. His belly is white but I have noticed some dark lines under his eyes. He seems fine now. I think he get moody sometimes and I have done tons of research on puffers and talked to many people before I bought them (I only found this site recently). I have enough salt in my tank and I am getting ready to do a water change this weekend. My tank is cycled and been set up for awhile. No one in my tank has died. Everyone is eating except my GSP he only eats when he comes out of hiding from my plants.

[sparks42]

you have them together in a 14 gallon?
I don't know about F8's, but I know a GSPs need at least 30 gallons EACH !

So he probably feels crowded. He needs his own plenty of territory to feel comfy.

Are you able to get hold of a larger tank?

[Happy_Puffer]

I am trying to get a bigger tank but I don't have a job right now and I'm going to college so right now I can't get a hold of one but I am asking around. Thanks everyone for your help but sadly my GSP died last night. I feel so bad as I fell in love with him from the moment I saw him. I still have the F8 puffer and he seems healthy and happy but I am still keeping an eye on him. I think I'm just going to keep him and not get another GSP till I can afford to get a bigger tank. Thanks again everyone!!

[Agnate]

Sorry for your loss, but you've made the right choice in waiting until you get a bigger tank.

PS - Student loans can buy you a VERY nice tank. Just ask my line of credit!

[Happy_Puffer]

I have been looking at some of other peoples tanks and I see that people have sand is that better? I have had some problems with sand in the past as I didn't know how to clean it or take it out of the tank without scraping the glass. Also I would like to make my F8 happy, hes happy now but after some of the tanks I have seen my looks horrible hee hee what kind of wood can I put in a brackish tank?

[t1gerbee]

hang on a minute...

you say your parameters are perfect, yet your GSP mysteriously died.

Can you post your ammonia, nitrite, nitrate readings so we can have a look... they may not be quite as perfect as you think... ie puffers cannot handle nitrate above 20PPM... most tropicals can handle higher...

what is your substrate? I wouldn't go changing it now, as there is something not right with your tank, and if you remove the substrate you'll wipe out alot of your good bacteria potentially causing a mini cycle. Not a good idea at the moment, wait for the tank to settle down....

Wood is not a good idea for brackish tanks, as the salt rots them, although you can get fake wood that would look nice...


what SG is your salt? Are you using marine salt?...


As far as i know there are no brackish algae eaters... or am i wrong on this?

[zombiefetus]

I'm sorry for your loss.

Sand isn't really better, some people just think it looks nicer (myself included), You'd clean sand the same way you would gravel, only you'd just skim the top of the sand with the siphon/python/whatever you're using to clean. Sand also needs to be stirred weekly to keep pockets of gas from forming.

Also- What other fish are in that tank? 14gallons is enough for the single F8 with no tank mates, if you have anything in there with it, including algae eaters (which are really just a waste of money unless you simply get them because you like the fish itself) take them out as quickly as possible, the bioload in that tank would kill them. The only fish that could live with an F8 are other low end brackish fish, but all commonly available low end brackish fish need tons of room (bumble gobies stay small, but should really be kept in groups, so again, more room is needed).

[Happy_Puffer]

I checked my levels and they aren't bad I don't have the exact numbers because my test doen't tell me that. I am getting new tests when I get some cash. I only have the F8 now and he is really little and I am in the process of transfering my fish right now. I am going to do a water change on Sunday. I have some new rocks that I would like to add to the old ones, I was wondering how shouls I do this without stressing my puffer? Also I know this is way off topic but I was trying to put a picture on my profile but I can't get the image to go smaller then 6KB how can I fix this I would really like a picture. Sorry for going off topic. But thank you for the help!

[crazedpuffer]

Sounds like you have test strips? Get liquid ones, much more accurate.
Also I assume you mean gravel? Just rinse it first and pour it in a corner and then move it around with your hand.

[Happy_Puffer]

Thanks for the tips. I don't want to stress my puffer out when I rearrange the tank. Yes I do have test strips and they are good ones, I have had liquid in the past and it ends up leaking all over the place.

[crazedpuffer]

Nahh just get liquid, there is a big difference between the 2.

[Jase]

I had a buddy with test strips and dieing tetras, so for fun I took my tests over there for an experiment. I let him take his test strip reading.
nitrates were a bit high, and small nitrite sign.

I took tests.
nitrates off the chart, and lethal nitrite and ammonia. I told him he's a fish idiot and then helped him cycle his tank. still has his tetras.

moral is, strips=bad, liquid=good. please get them.