Help! Normal F8 advice not working for sick fish

[Puffer?Ihardlyknower]

Hi,

my water parameters are 0ppm Am, 0ppm Nitrite, and 5ppm Nitrate. The tank size is 20 gallons with an aragonite/live sand aragonite substrate with one new F8 puffer. I've had him for two weeks and I cycled the tank with refrigerated Bio-spira at first. I kept him as fresh for the time until the tank cycled because they were keeping him in fresh (high pH) at the LFS. I was feeding him frozen prawn and bloodworms (until my live snails show).

My problem is that after a week and a day or two my puffer started getting a cloudy left eye, so i looked on your website, searched the forums and saw that PP said to make constant water changes and use melafix if necessary. At that point, the ammonia was at about 3ppm and the nitrite was at the same (3ppm) and there was no trace of Nitrate so I'm assuming the first bit of biospira and livesand that i used wasn't sufficient or was expired, so I went back to the store, bought another pack of bio-spira, made another 25% water change, and tossed it in with the new, aerated/treated/warmed water. The eye remained the same and the other one showed a little cloudiness the next day. I got another batch of 25% water and started dosing with Melafix at the recommended rate 10ml for 20gal on the bottle per day. I checked my water parameters today and they are as listed above. The tank appears to have biological filter but when I checked my fish today he was in a bad shape, I thought he was dead. Both his eyes were clouded over, he wasn't really moving, and his normal color had darkened on top a bit. I get the feeling that this is his last night if something doesn't happen. I have a 5 gal tank I could move him to if someone thinks that's a good idea. Thank you for your help.

[Nusquam]

I'm not sure if it's even related, but what's your s.g. right now and how are you measuring your parameters? Ie, hydrometer/refractometer, liquid or test strips, etc...

[Pufferpunk]

I'd get some marine salt in there. He may have suffered permanant damage from being in an uncycled tank. Ammonia/nitrite burn's the eyes, gills, etc. I am pretty much ready to stop recommending Bio-Spira anymore. It seems it's just not being kept properly & too many folks that are counting on it being fresh are losing their fish because it isn't!

[yunachin]

I don't use it or recommend it because I have heard so many horror stories from it.
Puffer,
I hope that he makes it.

[Puffer?Ihardlyknower]

He died overnight.

I agree, Bio-spira, while a good idea, is too reliant on storekeeper knowledge. My LFS (which isn't really local, they're the best one in the city about 50 blocks from me) did tell me about keeping it refrigerated (which I did) but they may have had a problem when they kept it. The second batch they sold me worked though, so I guess I'm completely non-plussed by it. Can anyone recommend how to keep my biological filter going and are there any necessary steps I should take with the current water prior to slowly raising the salinity? Also, any tips on doing that drip method to acclimate a new fish to the SG, I understand the idea, just don't know how it's done.

Thanks for your help.

[Nusquam]

So sorry for your loss

As for keeping the biological filter going, just throw in a shrimp or fish flakes...or any sort of food item that will rot and produce ammonia as it does.

[Pufferpunk]

You can keep it alive by adding straight ammonia to your tank--keeping the levels about 3ppm each day. I hate rotting carcasses on my tank!

[Puffer?Ihardlyknower]

I had noticed that from the fishless cycling articles and from reading about fishless cycling elsewhere on the internet. Just curious, where might I pick up straight ammonia (is it ammonia hydroxide I'm after?) and how much would one think would be enough to add to 20 gallons to make it about 3ppm. Sorry if I'm asking too many questions, you know good information is hard to come by in this hobby.

[Pufferpunk]

You're going to have to test, to see how much to add. Plain cloudy ammonia with no additives, should be found in a grocery, drug or hardware store.

[Puffer?Ihardlyknower]

Ok, I picked up standard Ammonia from the hardware store and an eye dropper, I'll let you know how the chemistry experiment goes. Perhaps if I solidify some measurements based on the tank size i have, someone could write an article for the encyclopedia section about keeping the biological filtration going.

[Pufferpunk]

That would be for our Library--great idea!

[t1gerbee]

can you get live sand for freshwater tanks? I thought it was just a salt water thing....

or did i learn something new at fish class today?

[crazedpuffer]

There is no live sand for FW tanks.
Where'd you her that?

[t1gerbee]

quote...'The tank size is 20 gallons with an aragonite/live sand aragonite substrate...'



He refers to using live sand in the tank... which was freshwater, or v. low end brackish at best

if he did, it would have died straight away, causing the massive ammonia spike....

That's assuming i'm understanding correctly what he wrote..?

[crazedpuffer]

He could have bought "aragonite live sand" Most the live sand sold isn't alive at all and will just buffer his ph.