Dogface extruding ??? from anus

[Shayla]

First off, specifics -- Salinity 1.025, NH3 undetectable, NO3 <20 (water change was planned for tonight, but we spent the evening trying to troubleshoot the whatever it is instead.

Tank is a 45 gallon inhabited by the dogface (3" currently, and yes, a larger tank is in the works) and a 1" Valentini, and three soft corals. (There was also a hermit crab and a peppermint shrimp that miraculously survived quite some time, but I haven't seen them recently and have to assume they became dinner...) Also live rock. None of these are new to the tank.

Water changes: 50% once a week, feeding: krill, fish goop a'la hard coral (i.e. smeared onto the coral skeleton), shrimp tails, clams, snails, varied to mix it up and keep things interesting. No specific changes within the last week -- tank has been established for several months now and was cycled before fish were added.

Two pictures, as otherwise I'm at a loss to describe (please forgive the quality, she was in a small specimen container in order to snap the photos):




Can anyone tell me what is happening and what i should be doing about it? It definitely wasn't visible until tonight, and she seems to be basically ignoring it. She has been eating and behaving normally, including tonight's feeding and up to present... Thoughts, ideas, please?

[Nick]

His intestine seems to have prolapsed and pushed out the anus. Has he recently had a large feeding of mostly krill? I say this because I see what appear to be veins with blood in them on the material sticking out. If thats what it is, it must be fixed or the puffer will die.

[Mareva]

I'm no fish expert, but this looks like anal prolapsus to me (link to definition, it's for humans but it can happen to fish too)
(http://www.everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=307800)

I did a quick google and there's not much info... there seems to be a bacteria that can cause this, although it says the bacteria lives mainly in freshwater and the fish would also be not eating and very thin, so it doesn't seem to apply to your case. Bacteria name is: plesiomonas.

Don't quite know what could cause this... in humans it's mainly caused by weakened muscles and surgery is the treatment. I guess a quit research in scientific articles with "anal prolapsus and fish" might help you find an answer.
Good luck!

[Shayla]

That's what I was afraid of -- and yes, he/she had krill earlier in the day, though my husband states that it wasn't a large amount. What does one do to attempt to fix it, though? Googling listed some descriptions that sounded similar and one thread discussing a fish in a similar condition, but I didn't find much by way of suggestions what to do, other than start antibiotics immediately... One site said there was nothing for it but to euthanize the fish, another said that it may "unprolapse" (given the seeming severity, I'd doubt that), or that it may seal itself off and take care of itself (which actually was what the poster in the conversation said had ultimately happened, though there was no follow up mentioning whether the fish had lived after the fact). So any suggestions what I should try?

Thanks...

[Pufferpunk]

Did you search here on that? I do believe there was a recent thread on the subject.

I PMed puffer Queen.

[taureandragon76]

I had the exact same thing happen to my veiled chameleon and it looked pretty much just like your puffers. I know mine was a reptile and yours a fish but a prolapsed anus is a prolapsed anus. From the research I did on it I concluded that it can be caused from improper diet meaning that it was fed more than it's digestive system can handle or fed food that takes the particular species longer to digest.

I don't think that your fish will unprolapse itself cause it does look pretty bad, one thing that can be done if you can find a vet that will do it or you could always try yourself is the fish has to be put to sleep then the anus has to be pushed back in and then they have to stitch up the anus cause it will be torn. I looked into getting this done for my reptile but was told that it doesn't always work and that sometimes it could fall back out.

So what I would suggest is try to find a vet that can and will fix it but will probably be big $$$$, or you may just have to euthanize your fish, I know the thought of that sucks but the condition he is in is probably causing him to suffer and would have difficulty properly digesting his food, or you could just wait it out and see if it does happen to fix itself which I really don't think it would cause of how far out it is

The one thing I have learned about keeping fish is make sure your the only one feeding them, I don't let my wife feed my fish ever cause if they were fed as often as she thinks they should they would more than likely be all gone by now.

Sorry for what your going through I know how it feels to have a pet going through distress

[Myaj]

The Figure 8 puffer I have gets that on and off (mostly on). Its not nearly as bad though. It doesn't seem to bother him one bit, still eating and swimming around. My biggest fear would be if the valentini decided to take a chomp on it...

[Pufferpunk]

That was the problem another poster had. His other fish were picking at the protrsion. Ouch! Fish should be in QT.

[Puffer Queen]

Definitely intestinal prolapse.

Here is another hobbyist that posted exact same problem recently.
http://forum.marinedepot.com/Topic75099 ... px#bm75129

[Shayla]

Quick update, more to follow later. When I awoke this morning and ran downstairs to check on her, Baby was sleeping (sorry, Baby, gotta look, can't wait, wake up...). She swam up (begging, already, of course) and, surprise, it was as if nothing had ever happened, everything looked normal, and she'd never acted anything but normal. I waited to follow up here until now, just to see if anything changed over the course of the day, but hubby says she's still looking and acting as if nothing had ever happened.

So I'll be wandering through the library to reconsider feeding options... She's been through a course of hypo before being put into this tank; should I think about treating prophylactically for worms now? I've seen no other sign of them, and she's been eating regularly all along, but...... Obviously, I'd like to do whatever I can to prevent a reoccurrence.

Thanks for the link and the advice, and also for responding so quickly last night -- I admit I was a bit beside myself wondering what to do...
Christene

[Pufferpunk]

Heck, I'd be freaking out too!

[Puffer Queen]

Watch closely as reoccurence can happen and each time the intestine, the chances of it returning spontaneously decreases.

Make sure at the first sign of prolapse that the puffer is segregated or isolated.

I would also consider deworming the puffer to eliminate any possible causes of future prolapses.

[Myaj]

Oh I'm glad to hear it went back in on its own! Frank's does too, but his never comes out THAT far.