The Puffer Forum

Hi there I'm new to puffers and would like some advice from heads far wiser than mine, i have a 30-18-15 [120L] tank at home and i would like to keep a group of 4-5 south Americans, the tank is filtered by a large external filter and a UV steriliser and the decor consists of large pieces of bogwood and rocks and is planted with java moss, java fern and anubis so there are plenty of nooks and cranny's, am i looking at a disaster or for a change are my plans quite fell thought out your advice would be greatly received

120L is nowhere big enough for 4-5 SAPs. I wouldn't recommend more than 2-3 at the very most.

In that size tank unfortunately you could only really have 2 sticking to the recommended gallons per SAP it's roughly 26UK/31US gallons.

I'm not sure the "litres/gallons per pufferfish" rule makes sense with SAPs, at least not as it does with, say GSPs or dwarf puffers.

These are schooling fish, and haven't the least interest in territories. All they care about is swimming space, since their main activity is swimming. Decorations, plants, caves, bogwood will all be unused, and frankly waste space. They definitely like floating plants though, and also quiet corners where they can "dig in" for the night, resting quietly as a group.

They don't get all that big, either. In 18 months or so, my oldest specimen has gone from about 3 cm to 5 cm. I've seen aquarium specimens 8 cm long ONCE in my life, and simply don't believe the oft-quoted maximum size of 15 cm.

So rather than fixating on the aquarium size alone, I'd factor in swimming space (i.e., length) and filtration (i.e., water quality AND current to swim into). On that basis, I think your problem isn't so much volume (I think 3-4 juveniles would be fine in 120 litres for at least 2-3 years) but swimming space. In my tank, which is about 1 m long, the SAPs swim from one end to the other in no time at all. On the other hand, they are so much happier as a group in terms of being settled and tame that I think "bending the rules" about stocking density may be a valid risk to take. I'm sure others would argue against that, and I'd make the proviso that overstocking a tank in this way depends on regular, substantial water changes and adequate filtration. I use rainwater for the water changes and have supplemented the built-in filter with a canister filter of appropriate size.

Cheers, Neale

So Neale do you think that as long as filtration is adequate and the tank has a good length, multiples would do well bending the rule of gallonage per puffer. I can see that working.

That would be my gut feeling, so long as the water quality was excellent and the fish were able to "stretch their legs" so to speak.

But I hesitate to put that forward as tried-and-tested advice, rather as a hypothesis. Mine haven't shown any territoriality, and nothing in their biology would suggest they ever hold territories at any point in their lives.

Cheers, Neale

nmonks wrote:That would be my gut feeling, so long as the water quality was excellent and the fish were able to "stretch their legs" so to speak.

But I hesitate to put that forward as tried-and-tested advice, rather as a hypothesis. Mine haven't shown any territoriality, and nothing in their biology would suggest they ever hold territories at any point in their lives.

Cheers, Neale

If no one tries, no one will ever know. I think as an idea to try out its a good one.

Thanks for all your help everyone, Taking your advice neale i shall remove some of the decor to create more swimming space, the filteration is already more then adequate though i shall create some more current in the tank and at the moment im doing 2-25% changes per week, i think i shall just stock 3 juveniles which brings me on to my next problem can anyone recommend somewhere that sells quality SAPs ?

Location?

I don't think you need to remove stuff from the aquarium if it looks nice, just don't add stuff on the basis of creating hiding places for the puffers. They won't use them. I've never seen mine go into a cave or bogwood crevice except perhaps to pull out a bloodworm they've spotted.

On the other hand, as with all puffers, creating a complex environment for them to forage across is worthwhile. I'd suggest arranging plants and rocks and wood across the bottom 1/3rd of the tank but leaving the rest of the tank as open swimming space. Use a spray bar if you can, to create some good water flow across the full width of the tank rather than just along one side. But the main thing is that there's lots of current. Add some floating plants if you can -- mine seem to like looking through the roots, and swim head-upwards almost at the vertical. It's very odd, but I'm assuming natural behaviour for finding prey in the roots of floating plants or whatever.

These are fairly widely sold in the UK, and I've seen them in at least one store this week in London (Maidenhead Aquatics, Wembley). They tend to be slightly more expensive than figure-8s and other common puffers, usually around £8-10. If you're outside the UK, I can't help.

Good luck!

Neale

I live kingston upon hull, i have found them locally but in very poor condition.

Here we go back to the discussion of gallons/SAP.. A topic I brought up.

15g per SAP is needed for maybe the first 2... But beyond that, I swear I could put 12 of these in my 55g and they would be having a blast..As long as the water quality is fine... There is no issues with the SAP. They enjoy being around each other... Not really true schoolers, but they will definitely feel safer. I have noticed that a few sleep while a few others stay on their nightly patrols

Of course 12 semi-annual teeth trimmings would be no fun.

SAP never uses any landscaping I put in there, other than scoping out for snails/bloodworms that fell to the bottom, you are correct there. They are more amused by water current than landscaping.

All they want is some "cover" (plants, wood), to feel more safe and homely.. They won't use it though.

I disagree that SAPs do not use landscaping - that is hunting territory along with security, and both of those I consider requirements. In bare or barren tanks they do not behave what I consider "normally".

I do agree that current, plus areas of relative calm, is imporant.

I think the problem is we're a long way from knowing what SAPs really want in captivity. The science suggests a mode of life very different to other freshwater puffers but rather similar to oceanic marine puffers (i.e., schooling fish, fast moving, broadcast spawners, planktonic larvae). Until such time as we get them to breed in captivity, everything is still experimenting at the moment.

Cheers, Neale