The Puffer Forum

Hi,

My name is Peter. I have a brackish water tank that has been cycled. The method I use was fishless cycling with raw shrimps. After a month (seeing the nitrogen cycle) the cycle is complete and I did a 50% water change. A day later, I went out and bought 2 puffer fish. An figure 8 and a green spotted puffer.

I have them for a week now, I feed them 2 times a day once at noon and once at night between brine shrimp, mysis, bloodworm, currently working on a sail colony. Today when I come to feed the puffers they will immediately swim up to the glass, after feeding (about 30 minutes later) I feel like they are hiding (please keep in mind that they are still trying to get use to the 30 gallon tank and have not really fully explore the tank yet). So I decided to do a water check ( I use the liquid test by API):

Ammonia: .5
Nitrite: 1

I freak out and I immediately did a water change 50 percent. Now there water condition is
Nitrite: .5
Ammonia: .25 - 3.5
Nitrate: 5

I think the cause of this is because I am overfeeding them, I put food in the water until their stomach is full and just eating things and spitting out the food when they are full. Any uneaten food, I remove from tank using fish net (that always has been my normal routine for the past week).

OKay finally getting to my questions
1) I don't want too much of a good thing to be bad thing, exactly how much should I feed thm?
2) How should I deal with the current water situation, I know doing full water change is bad that is why I didn't do it, so how much water change should I do a day to make this right. If a day if bad how about twice a week or every other day? I am also worry that if I do a water change every day it the cycle might slow down (I mean the current mini cycle it is going through from overfeeding).

And lastly, I know that 30 gallon is not enough for both of the puffer. I will eventually separate them once they are a little older (they are about 1inch) in about 3 - 4 months.

Now they are swimming about, but I don't think it is the water change that did it, I feel like they are hungry again because their stomach look just like every noon before they get fed.

Thanks for reading all of this,
Please help! Thanks

Feeding once a day with 1 day off is the norm.

your ;problem is overfeeding +bioload. puffers produce a lot of waste.

Changing most of the water is ok. The only time you should not change a lot of water is if you have not changed the water in a while. But, if you regularly change the water large water changes won't hurt.

Until your cycle gets better I would do a large change now and then 20-30% or more every day.

Figure 8s and GSPs do not make good tank mates. The GSP will get bigger than the F8 and F8s need low brackish while GSPs need full marine of high brackish. Take one of the puffer back or set up another tank.

In addition, 30 gallons is the minimum for 1 gsp. with 2 puffers you are overstocked.

How did you make the water brackish? What kind of salt? What is your salinity? When you change the water do you add more salt? How do you mix your salt?

What type of filter do you have (I am curious).

Welcome to the forum!!!

Hi,
Thanks for the quick response. will definitely do a 20 - 30 water change a day.
And to answer some of you questions.

How did you make the water brackish? What kind of salt? What is your salinity? When you change the water do you add more salt? How do you mix your salt?

The salt I used is instantly ocean salt. I put tap water in a 5 gallon bucket and dechlorinate it (waiting about 30 minutes) and then add salt (stirring it and wait another 30 minutes) then check to see if the temp is 78 degree and finally in the water goes. My salinity is 1.007.

I have read that they are not great tank mates. The petco that I went to have those two together (there were 4 GSP and 1 F8 in a 10 gallon tank). So when come to choosing puffers, I pick the F8 and a GSP that is smaller than it to compensate for the time it will take to separate them. I agree with you that I should return the puffer, but I cannot do it because then it will be in a 10 gallon with so many other puffers I do not mind spending the extra time in a day to deal with water changes to keep it clean

The filter I have is a canister filter Fluval 204 it is technically for a 40 gallon, but I only have a 30 gallon. There are three slots in there, one slot I fill it with the things that help maintain the bacteria, another I have carbon, there is one slot free. I am thinking about about putting the last slot with the thing that can remove nitrite and nitrate but I am afraid it might be bad for my good bacteria colonies. Your thought?

Thanks again ,
Peter

peterw wrote:Hi,

The salt I used is instantly ocean salt. I put tap water in a 5 gallon bucket and dechlorinate it (waiting about 30 minutes) and then add salt (stirring it and wait another 30 minutes) then check to see if the temp is 78 degree and finally in the water goes. My salinity is 1.007.

This might be part of your problem. You should mix salt overnight or for several hours. I attach an empty of filter machine and a heater. If you don't the salt level could rise in your tank..others can chime in on how that happens..a rise in salt could kill your bacteria.

Not really any need to let the water for a low end BW tank stand overnight. I never have done. If I were you, I would be doing 50%+ water changes daily - twice daily if necessary. You really need to get the ammonia to zero, quickly.

Thanks for everyone's response. I hope there will be more insights coming. But first let me respond to everyone's post.

Puffercandle: Yeah I understand where you are coming from about the rise in salinity will kill bacteria. Initially, my 30 gallon was cycled for a freshwater tank because I though petco had it in freshwater. When I went to buy it, the guy told me he has in brackish water so he refuse to sell me the fish and I had to go back home to make my water brackish. I read from an article that in order to convert from freshwater to brackish you will need to add .002 salinity per week so not all the good bacteria will die, it will give them time to adapt. Instead I just add the salt to about 1.006 and start over because I do not want any crazy thing to happen (shrimp fishless cycling). I will put your comment to test to see if the salinity does increase tomorrow. What I head from the petco employee, who is every experienced from my point of view, he saids that it really depend on what kind of salt you have if the salinity will increase or not. The reason salinity will increase, if you are adding water the way I am adding it, is if not all the salt have melted when I added the salt to the new water. It all depends on what kind of brand of salt you are using (he recommended Kent salt, but I already bought instant ocean so it seems to be dissolving without any problems). Also I just check the salinity again and it is still the same.

Bigfatfish: I really want the ammonia to go do to zero as soon as possible as well, but I want to test out pufflecandle's theory as well, just in case if does increase the salinity by alot then it will be even worst for the puffers. There is a little ammonia in there right now, but the puffer are showing no sign of stress except they are hungry and keep coming near me when I close begging for food. I am not sure why you guys manage to feed these guys once every other day. lol. I won't be feed them tonight. I am going to feed them once a day but the not the max amount I usually do. I will definitely will do more water changes tomorrow

I will keep you all posted
Thanks a bunch for all your advices.

Did you ask the employee what SG their BW tanks are at? Was their tank not plumbed into their main system?

Hello,
Pufferpunk. I am not sure if there tank are plumb into there main system. He says he had the salinity about 1.008 to 1.010, but he told me 1.005 is okay while they are young. But that particular petco have three different type of fish setup. Fresh, brackish, and Salt. Here is the layout of the store if it help answer your question. I am very sure the water is brackish because when combine acclimating the puffesr I can tell it salinity is slight high than mine.
From what understand (I am assuming all this, let call the drawing petco1 and another petco2) I saw how petco2 do their water change not petco1. But I think the system should be same. They have all the freshwater link together to their main system. For the salt water they had to do the water separately in a huge barrel like those large plastic garbage cans a mix it with salt etc. I am pretty sure they would do the same for brackish. Hopefully that answer your question

Heh, not really sure... I'd take your hydrometer over there & check it. Did you read our article on them?
library/puffers-in-focus/fig8/

Pufferpunk wrote:Heh, not really sure... I'd take your hydrometer over there & check it. Did you read our article on them?
library/puffers-in-focus/fig8/

I am not sure what you mean that your last comment. I have read this article before that is why I originally cycle the tank to be fresh water, until the petco person told me he had it in brackish and told me to come back when the tank is cycled in brackish. I waited for 2 months, but it is worth it!

Are you saying you don't understand the article comment or the hydrometer comment?

purplecandle wrote:Are you saying you don't understand the article comment or the hydrometer comment?

I under stood the whole article I was confuse about pufferpunk's :"heh, not really sure..." Is he saying I am not sure about something or he is not sure about something. Since I already bought the fish I am not going to go over to petco to proof the saleman wrong about something, but I am definitely there are salt in those puffer tanks.

LOL..

Imagine pufferpunk as a woman ..who is saying....

"Huh, <insert scratching head here> I am not sure what to make of those diagrams. Most pet stores don't have a brackish water section. Maybe the one he is talking about does or the pet store could be lying. I am not sure which "

We see pet stores lie a lot about their salinity..

I have a question. Is it wrong for me to assume that the puffer fish are doing good if they come to greet me when I come near the tank (even though they are probably hungry, lol) and all the fin and tails are spread. Because before the water change this morning there tail fins are clamped and they are not swimming around as much. Now there fins are spread and swimming like crazy, what they usually do. I really want to feed them too, but I cannot at the moment. sad face

peterw wrote:I have a question. Is it wrong for me to assume that the puffer fish are doing good if they come to greet me when I come near the tank (even though they are probably hungry, lol) and all the fin and tails are spread. Because before the water change this morning there tail fins are clamped and they are not swimming around as much. Now there fins are spread and swimming like crazy, what they usually do. I really want to feed them too, but I cannot at the moment. sad face

They curl into a ball and get dark when they are sleeping...trying to hide from predators