The Puffer Forum

Thanks for the help.

pH is 7.0, nitrates and ammonia and at favorably low levels. The tank cycled for over 2 weeks before getting any fish.

There is no "favorable" level of ammonia or nitrites. They must be 0 at all times. They also prefer a much higher pH of 8. Their immune systems are stressing from this & I'm afraid it's going to get worse. Melafix may help, but sorry to say your tank is not cycled.

What did you do to cycle the tank for 2 weeks? How big is the tank?

I'd start doing water changes to get the toxins removed, testing morning & night, doing more water changes accordingly, until you can get some Bio-Spira in there to cycle the tank.

that's what I meant by favorable, nitrites and ammonia were at bare minimum levels (ie for nitrites the first color on the test kit is for 0.1 and it's not even at that color yet)

what I mean is, both nitrites and ammonia barely show a color, barely meeting the minimum for my test kit (Hagen kit)

do you still think the tank is in as bad shape as you first mentioned? I can raise the pH as I do have crushed coral, it's just not yet in the tank

tank cycled for 2 weeks, I used Prime during this

So you just ran the tank empty for 2 weeks? Please answer the other Qs I've asked & read the info in The Library about cycling & water chemistry.

I can't remember exactly what I did day by day, but:

Day 1 - Filled tank with water, used Stability by Seachem (http://www.seachem.com/products/product ... ility.html) also added large pieces of lace rock from an established FW tank also for bacteria.

Day 3 - Added plants (about 10 bunch plants), which also later turned out to carry snails. Also added other ornaments.

Day 5ish - Started added marine salt. Sloooooooooooowly reaching a goal of 1.005 in a weeks time.

Day 7-8 - About a half dozen snails in the tank, all from the plants. Removed some of the plants that were in there as I found out they weren't aquarium plants.

Day 12ish - Reached 1.0005 salinity. It was around this time my nitrite levels spiked.

Day 17ish - Decided to replace plants I previously took out. Did a water change about 30% to lower salinity to facilitate the new plants. Snails keep multiplying and will leave in until I get the puffers (so I can breed where they won't get eaten). I also added Prime (Seachem) which I do every water change.

Day 18ish - Put in new plants. Salinity at 1.003

Day 22ish - Got puffers, removed snails, introduced them and the gobies into the tank.

From about Day 12 on I checked water every other day (if not, every day) for pH, nitrite and ammonia.

The water quality in the tank seems fine. I'm not too concerned with that, it's the white cloud/film on their eyes I'm worried about. Which I know could be a result of poor water quality but if it's not that then I wonder what it could be.

oh yeah and tank is 48g, filter is fluval 304

I also forgot to mention I added a medium sized container of gravel from an established tank also on day 1 of the cycle.

Please read the cycling article in The Library. You should be concerned about the water parameters, cause if they're off, your fish get stressed & sick, which is what they are now.

I did nitrite and ammonia tests last night and this morning. Ammonia at zero, nitrites about 0.02mg/L - my Hagen test kit starts Nitrite at 0.1mg/L and it's not even close to that so it's just an estimate. The test kit says 0.3+ is when you should start to worry and I believe I'm maybe at 1/10th that.

What I'm trying to say is my water is fine. This is the 4th tank I've cycled since early November. The others are 3 FW 75g/10g/10g tanks with 51 total fish that are doing great. Only 1 Harlequin Rasbora has died on me and it was paler then the rest when I bought him. This tank is also fine except the white film which is noticably better than it was yesterday.

No I don't believe I'm an expert, but I'm not a beginner either and water quality is the FIRST thing I'll always check with any possible sign of sickness. I also realise what toxic, and even detectable levels of nitrite and ammonia can lead to. I am new to puffers however so wondered if it was something those type of fish may have been more prone to.

---------But enough of my water quality (and yes, I have read that article in the library, and several others on the internet long before I ever bought a single fish)----------

I think it might've been stress/damage from transport as they had a long bumpy journey to me. Also changes in salinity as they were in a tank in florida, then LFS tank in British Columbia and now mine all in a 4 day span. But the film is clearing and only visible on 2 puffers both on right eyes (yesterday all 4 puffers on both eyes) so I'm satisfied they'll be ok. I just stressed out as I have no experience with puffers and care a great deal about my fish. They're eating, curiously exploring the tank and following me wherever I move around the tank. Snails only live for seconds when put in there.

But I would never take a fish home unless they had a clean, safe tank to come home to. Thanks for the help though, but I think I'll be fine. And yes, I will be working to get the nitrites to completely 0.

You need to get those nitrite and ammonia levels down to zero. Even though the tank is quite big, four F8s are gonna be quite a big bioload for it, so I'm with PP on this...the tank isn't cycled.
Get busy with some water changes..every day, and test every day, or else you may lose one or more fish. There should be no nitrites or ammonia at all...that's when your tank is cycled, and not before.
Pami.

I said my ammonia was at zero, now I'm told to get them down to zero

I said I was going to get my nitrites down to zero, now I'm told to try and get them down to zero.

For nitrites, I use prime to detoxify what may be in there and yes I do water changes. I know that dilution is key here. I said above "I will be working to get the nitrites to completely 0".

BUT I also think I may be a little color blind. The extremely light pink I think I see with that tank shows up with all my tanks, including one that's been running for 5 years. A second opinion told me I'm crazy and she thinks it's clear. I'm going to get a different test kit to make sure.

God help me if I hear that tank that's been up for 5 years isn't cycled

I think Pam and PP's point is that if you're showing either ammonia or nitrite, your tank isn't cycled, and this may be the cause of what you see. I personally wouldn't trust a product to deal with a substance as leathal as nitrite.

When you say your water is 'fine' and it's not a water quality issue, I think you may be mistaken, as ANY level of these substances, despite the ranges your test kit may say, can be deadly, and surely is stressing your fish, lowering their immune system. I'd bet that once your tank is cycled fully and stable, the cloudy eyes will clear.

Levels of nitrite or ammonia no matter how small can be deadly and should be taken care of immediately for safe and healthy fish.

There, I said it myself so now nobody else has to.

Please don't feel we're picking on you. I think your mistake was writing "favorably low levels". Since there is no such thing, regarding ammonia/nitrites, that threw us all off. I am glad that you are aware of this & that you would never take a fish home unless they had a clean, safe tank to come home to.