The Puffer Forum

As I have mentioned here before, I maintain many different tanks with just about every species in the Arothron Genus. Just recently, I lost one of my puffers to something that is very strange to me but I am hoping some of you all may be able to help!

My largest Arothron Stellatus (about 16") - I have had since he was no bigger than a Nickel (he was about 2 years old) had been doing fantastic, continuing to grow, eat and act as usual. About one week ago, almost overnight, he began to look extremely emaciated, his eyes began to sink in, his body began to shrink at an incredible rate and eventually he appeared so sunken in (eyes, fins etc.) that he no longer ate and VERY unfortunately died about a week ago.

Honestly I am at a loss - I have maintaned various puffers for 17 years now and never have I seen this. Just some background on his tank: He was housed in a 200G Aquarium with (1) A. Hispidus, (2) A. Nigropunctatus, (1) A. Mappa, (1) Queen angel, (1) leaflip grouper and one smaller Assasi trigger.

I am able to maintain the water parameters in pretty good shape considering the bio-load and this tank hasn't had a new addition or major system change in over 6 months. Ammonia and Nitrite were of course 0.0, pH had to be maintained almost daily to keep it around 8.1-8.3, Nitrates are around 30-40 (good for the messiest eaters of all fish) and everything else was in proper shape (protein skimming, water changes once every 2 weeks (20%) etc...)

My first guess was an internal parasite/worm but all of the animals had been de-wormed twice in the last 6 months and to date, all other fish continue to do extremely well. Also a necropsy revealed no worms in the gastrointestinal system and all internal organs appeared to have shrivled to almost nothing.

Sorry for the long explanation but I wanted to provide as much info as possible - Any ideas on what would cause this Stellatus to look so emaciated with sunken eyes and going from eating like a pig as usual to dying in 6 days....?

I'll be happy to answer any questions should I have missed any key info here but this really has me thinking...

Any ideas are welcome!

My suggestion to you is to write to Puffer Queen (our SW puffer Mentor) & link her to this post. If she doesn't PM you back, post in her forum at Marine Depot, telling her you posted here & I sent you over to her. Just be sure you post the correspondence back here, so we can all learn.

Thanks and I appreciate the referral - I'll do that and lets hope we can all learn...Since his death (I was able to determine he was in fact a "he" through the necropsy), I found no evidence of obvious bacterial infection, parasitic worms or other parasites both internal and external. My guess at this point is some type of virus, which although rare, can overcome puffers (and all fish for that matter) and can be virtually impossible to detect....

I will post as I get new info...

What's the difference between a necropsy & autopsy?

Nothing. It's the same definition.

"Necropsy is actually the exact same thing as an autopsy. However, the prefix "auto" means self, therefore, when performed on "one of our own" (i.e. human) it is called an autopsy. But when performed on a non-human, the term necropsy is used. Same thing, different application."

http://forums.officer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72834

Ok now that necropsy and autopsy are clarified any other ideas on what may have caused this sudden death? I have been researching and coming up empty - matter of fact I haven't found any other article or post talking about this....

I'm thinking it could be from the nitrate, when fish are exposed to high nitrate for extended periods of time there immune system starts to fail, maybe he was just overly sensitive.
Also what are you using to maintain the PH? You really shouldn't need to add chemicals and stuff like that to maintain the PH, especially in a marine system.

crazedpuffer wrote: Also what are you using to maintain the PH? You really shouldn't need to add chemicals and stuff like that to maintain the PH, especially in a marine system.

i wondered that... the salt alone should have created the correct pH... but if whatever he does has been the same for 2 years then it can't be that...

Rogue batch of salt and he was just the sensitive one being the biggest... rough batch of RO (assuming you use it) ... something he ate gave him poisoning/ or a blockage... unlikely to be a killer bacterial thing, because the chances of it not spreading to your other fish are slim...

or internal organ failure of some sort.. 16 inch for fish in a 200G is not great... especially when you add in all those other fish...

I recognise you are trying your best to keep on top of parameters but with overstocking as much as this none of your fish will reach old age...

t1gerbee wrote:

crazedpuffer wrote: Also what are you using to maintain the PH? You really shouldn't need to add chemicals and stuff like that to maintain the PH, especially in a marine system.

i wondered that... the salt alone should have created the correct pH... but if whatever he does has been the same for 2 years then it can't be that...

He still could have had a PH swing he was unaware of

crazedpuffer wrote:

t1gerbee wrote:

crazedpuffer wrote: Also what are you using to maintain the PH? You really shouldn't need to add chemicals and stuff like that to maintain the PH, especially in a marine system.

i wondered that... the salt alone should have created the correct pH... but if whatever he does has been the same for 2 years then it can't be that...

He still could have had a PH swing he was unaware of

True. Wouldn't that have killed the fish straight out, rather than over the course of a week.. ?

That's true, but some fish are more sensitive to a change than others, perhaps that puffer is very sensitive. Or there were a series of small changes... Or it has nothing to do with the ph lol