The Puffer Forum

We got a 4L bottle for about $30. Perhaps you can find something like that or do a lower dose. The guy at the LFS said we don't need to use the full dose if there's fish in the tank, he guessed to use about a half dose. No idea how true this is though.

Flutter: As usual,the guy at the LFS is displaying his stupidity. Lower the dose if there are fish in the tank? What does he think we have in our tanks? Rubber duckies? Greg Morin would faint. Or maybe bash in his head. (GM = originally the chief scientist at Seachem, now the owner).

J-P: There are two doses given, one for post-partial use, one for routine more frequent use. At least the more frequent use level should be used at least 2 - 3x weekly if possible. Lower levels may be ineffective. Concentration maters. The post-partial dose is much stronger and would harm some plants (particularly Val and Anancharis). For low to moderate light tanks, that is all I need. You should dose for the entire volume, but please do not pour it all into one tank at one time. I start and dose the last tank in the system and work backward (into the flow) such that the material is constantly being diluted. In a single tank, I dose into the strongest filter output, In tank/sump systems, I dose each separately, near an output tube. You do try for some dilution of any concentrated material that you add to a tank. Other techniques have their hazards.

Your potassium dose may be low due to the water softener, but if there are problems later, they can be adjusted.

RTR thank you again!

I have dosed only the 210 tank with the "water change" recomendation and hope that will cycle through the tank. As for the potassium, I added the recommended dose to the 210 and of couse I can alwayse add more if needed

I distrubuted it through the power head I have and, I hope, it provides the correct circulation. I suppose we'll see in the next couple days.

As an FYI I have added another 75 W Normal output 18" bulb and ballast to the 35 gal refrigerium section (where I was seeing the most die off). 2 HOB lights are waiting in the wings and I haven't figured out how to attach them to the tank as of yet (my glass is too thick)

So RTR, you would recomment the full dosing schedule of Excel then? 5mL per 50gal every or every other day.

I don't necessarily recommend it. It is what I use on my own tanks - all of which are a ~ 2 WPG/US NO tubes +/- 0.3 -0.4, almost all 6500K WS (or triphospor,whatever you want to call it) light. More are on the minus side than the plus - above 2.2, I need a lot more ferts and supplements and I don't want to have to do that.

I grow a limited spectrum of plants, generally where I already know they will do well,and many I have been growing for years. to decades Most of my set-ups are not new -with mulm and establish plantings, they have non-trivial "momentum" for lack of a better term. I know I can slight their care here and there, so long a I make up for it ASAP. When I do a"new" set-up, most of the plant are divisions or transplants from others of my tanks - there is little or no adjustment from one tank to another. "New" setups are initiated to be pseudo-mature when set - novices cannot do that. They do not have stockpiled mulm, they may not use the same substrate tank-to-tank where mine are frequently re-used substrates, and they do not have multiple established planted tanks from which they can harvest plants for the fresh set-up. There are huge advantages to setting tanks with plants that don't involve much guesswork on my part. I do try new plants routinely, but one new plant in a tank is certainly trivial in any case. I can read my tanks at a glance. I cannot do that on someone other than myself - I do not know their handling or the detailed setup. What is easy for me may be hard for you and vice versa. I have been growing aquatics forever. Very little of it is new to me -it would be unfair for me to say "just do this or that" - those techniques may be familiar to me and Greek to you. As in most things about tanks, the devil is in the detail. Small things can trip you up. J-P's water softener is going to create extra work for hum, but he will develop an eye for certain deficiencies that I do not have - he will handle them just by noticing and compensating - almost automatically. When I respond to posts, I fear most that I will forget some detail - like a whole-house softener that will result in problems for the person I am supposedly "helping". I know my water profile as well as the utility techs. I have no idea about yours. That is not trivial -my water after my dosing may be quite different from yours after the same dosing. I am more comfortable saying what I do. I cannot and so will not promise that it will do the same job for you. It should help, but there are no promises. Adjustments, hopefully minor ones, may well be needed.

All that is also why I sign off with HTH - HopeTthis Helps.

Alright. So I'll dose as the bottle says and go from there. What would be some visible signs of carbon source deficiency? Is there a website that outlines different deficiencies and their signs (or is it symptoms, I always get those two mixed up, signs or symptoms, signs or symptoms)? If not, if I made another post about this would you be willing to go through it all?

Yes, but I am having a "senior moment." There used to be one guy whom everybody bought dry ferts and supplements from... he also had multiple dosing calcultions on-site, and an extensive description of deficiency and/or excess interference symptoms. The original guy gave up the business, and I cannoit remember the current name. I got lazy and have used only prepared stuff from long before the change-over. Even if it is still the same site name, I'm drawing a blank.

Anybody buying dry materials and DIYing?

RTR wrote:Anybody buying dry materials and DIYing?

I do a quick hunt on APC and edit this later.

Flutter you can also check http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/

A lot of those guys are doing some rather unusual stuff as far as planted tanks go (like using miracle grow as a substrate).

Ok I got a list of links off APC ... these are interesting and comment worthy ...

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/foru ... chart.html <=== seachem's dosing schedule

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/foru ... guide.html <== another dosing guide

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/foru ... doser.html <== automatic dosing

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/foru ... rence.html <== fert guide

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/foru ... -pmpd.html <=== atricle on DIY mixing

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/foru ... -help.html <=== ??? forgot


http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/foru ... 2-kcl.html <==dry ferts

APC is a good place, and huge - some really sharp folks (including some friends locally) hang out there. I used to play there a bit, but too many folks there are too high tech for me - but that is fully valid for them. It just is not me, and high-tech and low tech do not communicate well. We have very different aims. When they added so-called "natural aquaariums" to the stew pot, it was too much for me and I quit going there - that woman is one of my bete noir.

I transplanted the loach yesterday. At first it seemed stressed but then setteled in, ate and started exploring.

I got up today, fed the fish .. no loach! Buddy swam upstream into the next tank! I can understand down stream, but up? I am not sure if this is a good thing or not.

Anyway, still got lots to do. Have to clean up the electrical and hook up the timers. The LED moon lights are all in place and hooked up (looks nice).

Have to find out what the "bugs" in the tank are and start breeding the snails.

I think the next step is to introduce the Cherry Red Shrimp as a cleaning crew. Maybe they'll take care of the bugs if I can ID them

LOL! Lots of fish do routinely swim upstream. When I had my favorite 'natural' breeding setup for the rainbows, I got as many or more new fry swimming upstream into that tank as downstream into the next tank. (Setup was 40-log for adults in the middle, two 30-long early fry tanks, one to each side of the breeding tank. After early growth, fry were moved to grow-out tanks by size.)

If I load in baby bristlenose into that system for grow-out, they spread through the three tanks most quickly if i load them into the downstream tank. During grow-out, I have to periodically redistribute them to keep the loading about equal - most tend to be in the most upstream tank.

I knew about fish going up stream ... but jumping a 4" barrier? Maybe he thinks he is a salmon

I believe I got all your your posts deleted for you Groove..Just FYI you can delete your own posts by going into the edit option in the right hand corner of the post. hope this helps

Re: Help! J-P's Set up

Post by groovitudedude on Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:22 am
A 6" loach? Clown I'm assuming?
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=19691&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=30 <==missed that one...

Ok... this is a difficult one for me (there are 2 points of discussion):

I need a little more advice concerning my GF (Gold Fish).

I have uploaded a video and you can see this 1 of 2 ways: A) since gold fish are smart, it is comical, or B) since gold fish are not so smart it is torture.

At first I thought it was funny, thus I took the video. I thought they were “playing” in the current. As you can see, they were moving in and out of their own free will. It was a daily exercise for them.
Then, it occurred to me, that they were after the air bubbles and getting caught in the current. After closer observation I believed this to be true.

I then transplanted them to a larger section 76 Gals, and watched them in that tank. The nutters are in the current again! Although, not nearly as much. I wonder if they were just exploring and getting caught in it.

Which, brings me to a 2nd and 3rd question: I mentioned earlier that the tank temp in the final tank is lower than the first one. This is true by about 2 degrees (at the level of the substrate). The actual surface temp is even across all tanks (holding at 75F).
I don’t have tape on thermometers for every tank. SO.... How accurate are they and should I place one on each tank?


One confused fish keeper :/

P.S. I think my cat ate 2 of my Otos ... found large splash marks on the side of the tank