The Puffer Forum

Occasionally, with competition, yes.

That is why some of us rear our own live food whenever possible. To me, rearing is far easier and cheaper than running multiple smallish QT tanks. I could not keep puffers at all without snail tanks.

Hey ashes (and a response to jerry's observation),

jeromecarlyoung wrote:i used to have a DP which ate snails only, 2-3 small snails a day. That would take a lot of breeding.

Jerry, that's exactly what I thought (the sheer amount of breeding it would take), and even though I was hoping for the reproductive best of my snails, I had this little thought that I might just have to keep buying and quarantining. My experience so far has been exactly the opposite. I am in the process of quarantining a batch of about 40 pest snails (I thought they were ramshorns, but learned they were pond snails) that I got from e-bay. Within the first week, there were literally hundreds (too many to even attempt to count, and I tried) of eggs in that tank! I still have about 2 weeks to go before I'll feed the original snails to my puffers, but I was astonished at the rate the snails multiply. It's shocking! They reproduce quickly, and in vast quantity.

Breeding enough snails to keep up with even the most snail-loving of a puffer's appetite? Not a problem.

"Pest" snails are generally, common pond snails. Perfect for smaller puffer species.

Well, 2-3 snails a day and having 40 of them that would be about just over 2 weeks supply. There is little chance in getting these baby/egg snails to mature in that time, not a chance.
Ebay seems a lot of hassle. Try the LFS store and get them for nothing. You do run the risk though. I've said before; it is a little like an over active love life- if you share yourself about too much you will pick up something nasty (means if you introduce new fish/snails etc then each time there is a chance of a new infection arriving in your tank.
I know it is interesting seeing the DP do there stuff but i would try to get live Daphnia off the ground and have Bloodworm as your main and the odd snail for a treat. The Tanks needed for a supply of 2-3 snails a day would be huge. That's over 900 snails a year!!
Up to you though.
Cheers Jerry

PS- I have heard that Flake should not be on the menu but Pufferpunk has been around longer than me so I defer to her greater experience.

I generally can pick out hundreds from Petco/Petsmart's tanks.

And once the snail colony is established in the snail tank (it may take a several months), you'll have a constant cycle of small snails of the proper size. In my tank, it took 9 days for the original eggs to hatch, and each day more eggs have been produced. It will take time for those snails to mature, and of course the turnover rate is dependent on the amount of time this takes and how big you need the snails to be before you feed them to your puffers. I also have no idea if this rate of egg production is steady all year or if I can expect natural fluctuations. This really only requires patience on the front end in order to give the cycle a chance to establish itself. I'll keep you posted on the number of homegrown snails I feed my puffers Well, not really, i'm sure you're probably not that interested in my particular snail experiment, lol. I imagine that some of the puffer-keepers on this site raise astonishing numbers of snails though!

Also, I think , not sure, that Leeches may decimate your Snails. I had two Leeches and had a lot of snail deaths at the same time, could be coincidence.
Also if you get MTS snails, they may need a bit of heat as they seem to be tropical. I had a lot of wasted MTS snails and my tank is unheated. Could be that the LFS may have treated with a snail killing treatment

Cheers Jerry

I have a 5 gallon that I breed Ramshorns in. My Fahaka can't keep up. He gets 1-2 a day, along with his normal diet of pellets and earthworms (and the occasional convict fry if he can catch them).

For my Ceylon, I have MTS (Malaysian Trumpet Snails) in 2 different tanks. They are litterally crawling with them. He usually gets 1-2 a day, alongside his diet of frozen krill, clams and the occasional earthworm.

The concept of feeding a Fahaka, even a young one, from a 5 gallon tank is a bit overblown. That is not going to happen. You need to be a bit more realistic on your breeder tank sizes.

I have never had any issues feeding a room full of puffers on home-bred snails. That included multiple F-8s simultaneously. whose diet was >90% (closer to 95%) home reared snails, along with tanks of SAPs getting the same diet. Obviously I did not use 5 gallon tanks for breeding and rearing. Those tanks were outfitted and maintained exactly like my other tanks - with filters, water partials, lights, etc. exactly like those on my fish tanks. Snails are fantastically productive, given decent care. There is no magic involved, just the same care given to any other hobby tank.

When done with forethought and decent care, it is cheap and easy, and there is never a shortage of safe and appropriate food.

HTH

RTR wrote:The concept of feeding a Fahaka, even a young one, from a 5 gallon tank is a bit overblown. That is not going to happen. You need to be a bit more realistic on your breeder tank sizes.

I have never had any issues feeding a room full of puffers on home-bred snails. That included multiple F-8s simultaneously. whose diet was >90% (closer to 95%) home reared snails, along with tanks of SAPs getting the same diet. Obviously I did not use 5 gallon tanks for breeding and rearing. Those tanks were outfitted and maintained exactly like my other tanks - with filters, water partials, lights, etc. exactly like those on my fish tanks. Snails are fantastically productive, given decent care. There is no magic involved, just the same care given to any other hobby tank.

When done with forethought and decent care, it is cheap and easy, and there is never a shortage of safe and appropriate food.

HTH

Maybe I'm reading this wrong... Why is a 5 gallon not appropriate? I have it filtered and there is a light (it's under a 55 gal where a sump would go). It is not heated.

I only feed him snails for beak wear. Not for nutritional value, so it is plenty for me. I started with about 50 snails, and now have 300+. I feed him 1-2 a day. He gets the bulk of his nutrition through the pellets I feed him. I also forgot to mention that I have a 55 gallon with marmorkrebs. IMO, they're a much better food source than snails. The multiply fast and have hard shells as well. You can feed them all sorts of good food that in turns ends up in your puffer.

icic the snails are only snacks for the fahaka. I have 3 SAPs, 2 DPs and 4 snail breeder tanks. I can't keep up and would assume that a fahaka fed on mostly snails would chew through that in a couple days. Having marbled crays in the food mix presents a different picture.

Aren't MTS shells too hard for larger Puffers to eat leading to damaging the beak. Ramshorn and Pond snail shells are easy to crush but to crush an MTS shell would need a lump hammer?? I only have a DP who goes in the entrance to suck out the snail so I don't really know.
-Jerry

Personally, I would never use MTS for any puffer due to the hardness of the shells. I use common pond and ramshorn snails only.

The giant puffers need crunchy foods other than the snails used to keep smaller puffers dental plates in control. The few snails produced in a 5 gallon tank are unlikely to be sufficient crunch for any giant puffer's needs. Other crunchy foods are needed. If you are providing such, what is the point of the snails?

Snails can and should be highly nutritious - it is absurd to ignore their food value for those fish of appropriate size to eat them. If the fish consume enough snails to control their dental plates, the food value cannot be ignored - it is a significant part of their diet.

jeromecarlyoung wrote:Aren't MTS shells too hard for larger Puffers to eat leading to damaging the beak. Ramshorn and Pond snail shells are easy to crush but to crush an MTS shell would need a lump hammer?? I only have a DP who goes in the entrance to suck out the snail so I don't really know.
-Jerry

I don't feed MTS to my Fahaka, only my Ceylon (Tetraodon Fluviatilis). He has a very strong beak and MTS are easy for him to crunch. i can probably get a video loaded of him eating a few. I'll do it after the holidays as with the pics.

RTR - I must be explaining myself wrong. My Fahaka is only about 6". 9 months old or so. I feed him pellets, marmorkrebs, snails, worms ("canadian" nightcrawlers, earthworms and red wigglers) and the occasional convict fry (if he can catch them). I understand the nutritional value of the snails, as well as the krebs. They're both mostly used as beak wear (snails, krebs). Is this not sufficient? I can increase the "crunchy" foods if need be (please suggest). The pellets are the main source of his nutrition. He is a beautiful specimen, growing at a great rate. I will post pics of both (puffers), after the holidays, PROMISE!