The Puffer Forum

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 8:47 am**

LilGreenPuffer wrote:You, sir, are a nincompoop.

We've already asked you not to curse on this forum, as we have very young posters, so please refrain from doing so.

hehe Sorry <3 ??

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 10:03 am**

bigfatfish wrote:
gi1911 wrote:I am done with this forum. This is my second post of concern about by puffer since I've had him and both times all I hear about is that this little
3 inch fish needs a $20,000-$30,000 - 1,000 Gallon tank. I understand it can give massive. When and if we get to that bridge of it getting 2 feet or greater in size, then we will
cross it with care and concern with the fish's best interest as the first priority. This fish's health is important to me and I never can get a relevant answer to a current concern. All I wanted to know
is what are reasons why the fish is breathing rapidly. If anyone has experienced it before and is there a way I can calm it down.

I have discussed this 1,000 gallon tank issue with everyone in real life, including marine biologists, Houston Downtown Aquariam employees I've ran into,
as well as multiple fish service/store owners. They all disagree with the 1,000 gallon concept unless its a commercial attraction. I can't get in contact with
any of these people on a Sunday morning, thus why I haven't asked them my dilemma. It would be hard to convince anyone to make such a purchase and that would
take up an entire room in their residence.

Thanks for nothing Pufferforum.com
I feel very sad after reading this post. You wanted to know why your puffer was breathing rapidly - the reply you got was asking all about water condition etc, that is imperative in the well-being of any fish. There is no way your question could have been answered without people from the forum enquiring further about the conditions the mbu is kept in. I am a vet nurse & it would be like someone phoning the surgery & saying "my dog is breathing heavily - why?" There is absolutley no way that could be answered without alot of questioning - & even then, we would probably need to see the animal. No body was having a go at you, just trying to point you in the right direction. Alot of people post on here, who have been given bad advice from shops & have no idea that the cute little puffer that is currently 2" long is going to grow the size of a small family car! Most are shocked & horrified that they have been given the wrong info & most want to do right by the animal. Yes, 1000 gallons is an advisory tank size for a Mbu, there is no law! No doubt yours will do ok in a smaller tank, but he could do much better/grow larger/live longer in the largest possible tank. The people on this forum love Puffers & want to do their best to ensure each one has a long & happy life - especially as alot of them have been plucked from the wild. I hope you will rethink your situation & return to the forum - you will meet some fab people & get some great advice. Just try not to take things personally - remember a forum is for advice & for people to express opinions. Most importantly, I hope your little Mbu is ok?
I'll stop rambling now!!

+1

Awesome!!

I cannot see a 1' long mbu in a 72 gallon. That's about 4' long, or less. That'd be like sticking you in a closet. How would you feel? And you had to poop and pee in there too. And sleep, and eat.

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 10:28 am**

Very well written, bigfatfish.

I fully agree with those saying that the tank should be as large as possible as I think it's only logical. We're taking animals that have evolved to live in the oceans and putting them indoors in tanks. Just because a fish looks like it fits the tank doesn't mean it does. You could be feeding it and thinking it looks happy and all the while it's having it's growth stunted and it's lifespan shortened. If you are not prepared to offer the best possible home for any animal, then don't get it. To me it's comparable with getting that cute puppy from the rescue shelter and it keeps growing but you keep it in an apartment thinking that it'll be fine when, in reality, it's a 100+lbs dog that needs to have a garden and long regular walks.

The only reason some writers come across strongly is because they care very much about the animals in question. If you buy a fish and find out that you cannot meet it's needs, do the same as you would with the dog, find it a new home where the people are willing to invest in what it needs.

In this case, I'd be willing to take the word of people who have owned and cared for puffers for as long as I've been alive and go for the 1000g tank for an MBU.

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 10:43 am**

Well, a 72 gallon is a bowfront tank and only 15 inches front to back so once the fish gets big enough it won't be able to turn around. Water quality really isn't an issue if you are willing to make a filter or spend the money on a filter that can filter that much bio waste, it can be done but will be expensive, might as well put that money towards a larger tank. The last and biggest issue is hormones in the water, those you can't filter out, just dillute. There's a nice article posted on stunting and the effects of hormones on scaleless fish. When you talk to a marine biologist they usually talk in terms of scaled fish that have a higher tolerance for hormones and can do better in what we consider cramped conditions. Scaleless fish have a much higher reabsorbption rate of hormones have a higher sensitivity to waste products because they are missing that protective layer.

When the recommedations are made for a large tank it isn't just because we think that the fish deserves a huge place to live, it's for dilution of hormones and waste.

One last thing, if you want to make an argument or prove a point, swearing does not help your cause. It nullifies the argument by lowering the coherency and makes people think less of your intelligence level. Please stop with the poor language.

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 10:45 am**

I hope you know, Walrus Head, I'm 12.

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:11 pm**

Look at me I have a FAHAKA PUFFER who grew from 2 inches to 5 inches in a 10 Gallon Tank. Then I upgraded him to a 20 Gallon Tank and hes has grown to 8 INCHES LONG in 6 Months

You must be really proud of yourself! Crowding that poor puffer in a tank it can barely swim in.

I can guarantee you it won't have a very long lifespan, which runs into the teens. Do you keep your dog in a cage all day too?

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:40 pm**

Pufferpunk wrote:
Look at me I have a FAHAKA PUFFER who grew from 2 inches to 5 inches in a 10 Gallon Tank. Then I upgraded him to a 20 Gallon Tank and hes has grown to 8 INCHES LONG in 6 Months
You must be really proud of yourself! Crowding that poor puffer in a tank it can barely swim in. I can guarantee you it won't have a very long lifespan, which runs into the teens. Do you keep your dog in a cage all day too?

Fish are 3D they can Swim UP/ Down aswell as along the Tank unlike Dogs who can only run along the floor of a cage coz their Dumb. Mine is growing normally and is always happy. I think a 1000 Gallon Tank is a really dumb idea for a 3 foot MBU thats way too much water!!!! Lets compare shall we? a 3 foot MBU that sits on it butt all day and put it in 3,785 Litres of Water LOLWUT. 1000 Gallons of water is ~ about 3.8 Tonnes of water. There is no way you can justify putting a 3 Foot MBU into 4 Tonnes of water

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:49 pm**

Think about. Would you rather live in a closet or a house? Even thought you may sit on your butt all day you still need/want room. Dogs are not dumb, but when you shub them into a cage and they don't even have enought room to turn around I don't think they will.

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:51 pm**

Lil' Swimz$ wrote:Think about. Would you rather live in a closet or a house? Even thought you may sit on your butt all day you still need/want room. Dogs are not dumb, but when you shub them into a cage and they don't even have enought room to turn around I don't think they will.

yeh they room but 4 Tonnes of water is tooo much, that equivalent to having a full tank that weighs as much as 4 Cars!

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:52 pm**

How much does your hosue way? I'm sure its not light!

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:53 pm**

Considering they come from millions of gallons of water, how can there ever too much water?

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:56 pm**

Fish are 3D they can Swim UP/ Down aswell as along the Tank unlike Dogs who can only run along the floor of a cage coz their Dumb. Mine is growing normally and is always happy. I think a 1000 Gallon Tank is a really dumb idea for a 3 foot MBU thats way too much water!!!! Lets compare shall we? a 3 foot MBU that sits on it butt all day and put it in 3,785 Litres of Water LOLWUT. 1000 Gallons of water is ~ about 3.8 Tonnes of water. There is no way you can justify putting a 3 Foot MBU into 4 Tonnes of water

Not sure fish can have TOO much water! Perhaps the Mbus you have seen "sit on their butts all day" cos they have no choice in the matter! Anyway, it isn't just about swimming space, its about the whole environment that we subject them to, we shouldn't have to "justify" what is acceptable. Not sure that any argument would change your opinion on the matter, so I think we may all have to agree to disagree - there are those of us that would love a mbu or a fahaka but know that there is no way on this earth that we could cater for their needs & requirements in a way that is acceptable to us, so we opt for a fish that is smaller, so that we know we are able to offer them the longest, healthiest & happiest life possible - still only a poor second to being left in the wild though. We owe it to them.

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 2:27 pm**

Walrus Head wrote:
Pufferpunk wrote:
Look at me I have a FAHAKA PUFFER who grew from 2 inches to 5 inches in a 10 Gallon Tank. Then I upgraded him to a 20 Gallon Tank and hes has grown to 8 INCHES LONG in 6 Months
You must be really proud of yourself! Crowding that poor puffer in a tank it can barely swim in. I can guarantee you it won't have a very long lifespan, which runs into the teens. Do you keep your dog in a cage all day too?
Fish are 3D they can Swim UP/ Down aswell as along the Tank unlike Dogs who can only run along the floor of a cage coz their Dumb. Mine is growing normally and is always happy. I think a 1000 Gallon Tank is a really dumb idea for a 3 foot MBU thats way too much water!!!! Lets compare shall we? a 3 foot MBU that sits on it butt all day and put it in 3,785 Litres of Water LOLWUT. 1000 Gallons of water is ~ about 3.8 Tonnes of water. There is no way you can justify putting a 3 Foot MBU into 4 Tonnes of water

And again you have missed the point entirely. It's not only a matter of swim room, there are biological factors involved that, whether you sit on you but all day or not, cannot be changed.

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2009 2:31 pm**

unlike Dogs who can only run along the floor of a cage coz their Dumb

Ummm... yeah right...

Posted: **Wed Aug 26, 2009 4:46 am**

My MBU sadly died.

Pufferpunk... a dog and a fish are very different issues. A fish is not even as close in complexity as a a dog's brain activity and overall anatomy.
If a fish isn't breathing normally, there's only a few potential issues (which you have yet to list). It doesn't take a lot of knowledge to know that difference. What's amazing is I gave detail
after detail, always starting my off my posts by answering the top "Read this before posting". All the other fish are great and happy and have NO problems. Just the puffer.

It's a good thing you are a vet nurse, because you don't have the capacity to be the decision maker. You shouldn't take that as a personal shot,
but unless you are well versed in what you do then you shouldn't be allowed to troubleshoot the matter.

I suggest you give the reign to someone else for this forum that is worthy. You can take that personally, Pufferpunk.

The Puffer Forum

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