Do SAPs need tankmates or not?

[Myaj]

Is it a 20 long or a 20 high?

If its a 20 long, and you can truly keep up with very large water changes and plant it heavily, AND resist the urge to add tankmates of any kind (other than snails and red cherry shrimp) I think you could pull it off with two.

If its a 20 high, it might be tougher, because these are very active fish that need the swimming room.

Whatever you do, give them LOTS of current, LOTS of live plants and they'll be happy.

[By_a_coo]

Sorry, I don't know what you guys mean with 20 long or 20 high? What's the difference?

I've noticed that my SAP is pleased with the present current, he's not pacing up and down the glass like my F8 does. What if I can't find another SAP to keep him company?

It's hard to find SAPs around here...

[riggers]

I'm not sure either, over here we don't really get highs and longs really. But basically I think it is just one is higher than the other which is longer. It isn't essential that you get another one, myaj was just saying you could get 2 if you want so long as it is a 20 long (don't know what the measurements are for a 20 long). But like myaj also said, it will be more work.

[Pufferpunk]

How's his teeth?

[By_a_coo]

He's 2 inches now... so I'm not sure if his teeth have to be trimed. When he was eating, I had to crack the snail's shell to allow the puffer bites it. Should I try to trim his teeth and wait to see if it was the big deal?

[Myaj]

A 20 high is 20" long by 12" front to back by I think 24" tall.

A 20 long is 30" long by 12" front to back by 12" high, so it allows for more swimming room back and forth, with less up and down room. Since SAP's are so active, they need to be able to zip around.

Look at the dentistry article in the library, there are some pictures of SAP's with trimmed teeth and overgrown teeth, that should help you figure it out.

[By_a_coo]

I guess the measures of the tank is within the average:
24'' long by 15,7'' front to back by 11,8'' tall

I already read that article and I trimmed one puffer's teeth too (now I know how brave I am ). That was nice and easy... no big deals.

If that photos in the article shows an overgrown teeth... my puffer's teeth are far away from that!

[Myaj]

Huh, that's a weird size tank.. I may be wrong and a 20 High is 24 inches long.. yeah, a 10 is only 20 inches long now that I think about it.

But the 15 front to back and only 11 high, that's odd... I guess we could call that one a 20 wide

[riggers]

Make your mind up!

So now you can decide, one or two SAPs?

[apachepufferman]

I think you would be fine with 2 saps just do your weekly water changes and keep an eye on your water parameters.

Now the fact that he is not eating I would try a different food other than snails maybe some bloodworms. If you can see his teeth at all and if they look even a little bucktooth I would trim them. You know its not that bad and it can't really hurt. He may just like a little mix up in food.

[apachepufferman]

Ohh that tank looks really good too!!!

[By_a_coo]

Myaj - That's not an odd tank's measure, it's common around here because we use centimeters instead of inches. It's common to use larger tank than taller one.

Riggers - I don't even know if my only SAP will be alive tomorrow. Now, he is in VERY bad shape... skinny, swimming as if he was dizzy, not eating... he's really bad! (I feel so sad for it)

Apache - That water change stuff doesn't really bother me! I love to do it. By the way, he was eating snails because I tryed mussels, freezed dry bloodworms, shrimps... and he did deny all of them, he was just eating snails until last week. Seriously, I have no clue why he stopped to eat! Before that, he was putting on weight... I'm not sure if I have to trim his teeth as I mentioned he's not feeling good... or should I?

[apachepufferman]

It probably wouldn't be good to trim his teeth if he is getting worse. I would do a large water change. Maybe something got in the water that you don't know about. If you have tried that then maybe it was a snail that disaggreed with him. I hope he pulls through. Just keep the water pristine and thats the best you can do.

as a afterthought check you water from tap. If you did a recent water change and your water might have changed. Up here in the states if our water department is doing maintenance it can really mess with whats comming out of the tap water.

Also you said that it is hard to get SAPs where you are at. Aren't SAPs from Brazil????

[Myaj]

Ah, I missed that you are in South America. That's cool that you have the wider tanks front to back, most of us up here prefer them but they can be harder to find, usually referred to as "breeder" tanks because they provide more "floor space" for territories.

Hmm.. skinny and not eating.. have you noticed it passing any feces? If so, where they white and stringy? It could be internal parasites, most puffers have them but do okay until they are under stress from being shipped to a store, etc. Once they get to the point that they aren't eating any more it can be really tough to bring them back, if that is the problem. You're pretty much limited to medicating their water and hoping that does the trick, or medicating food and trying to force feed it.. something I can't even imaging trying with a little SAP myself.

Can you get a picture of it? Usually a really sunken in belly from parasites has a certain "look" to it...

Personally, I would not try to sedate him or do anything that would stress him out more until you can get him eating again, since you say his teeth are not nearly as long as the ones in the article.

[By_a_coo]

I moved him to a QT yesterday (he has that bad shape, but he's not lethargic like he was in the planted tank), when I have a fish in a QT my WC is 100% daily to keep it VERY pristine!

Tap water parameters:
O2 - > 11 ppm
NH4/NH3, NO2, NO3, GH, KH - zero
PO4 -0,5 mg/l
PH - 7.2

I can't see anything "strange" in my tap water...

Well, actually I live in Brazil (and SAPs too! LOL), but it's easier to find F8s than SAPs... don't ask me why! Probably, it will arrive more SAPs at the LFS next wednesday... I don't know if I should get another one, cause I'm feeling I'm not able to keep one SAP alive and healthy.

Myaj - That could be IP, he was eating and his poo was normal suddenly he stopped to eat, I didn't notice any stringy and whitish poo since that happened... I have some metro, prazi and levamisole but I don't think that adding these med in the water would do the trick.