Technical question

[billysgirl4e]

If you're stocking a saltwater community tank, w/ lr, ls, protein skimmer, and wet/dry +sump... what is the rule for how many gallons per fish? is it still the same amount as Live Aquaria (for instance, 3 valentinis would overstock the tank?). Please let me know.
Thanks
J Bishop

[Nick]

Be careful with the wet/dry and live rock together. The wet/dry can generate a LOT of nitrates if you don't keep it very clean, and with a lot of live rock many consider it unnecessary and would use the space for a nitrate-eating deep sand bed instead. There is more flexibility with large salt water tanks than tanks without live rock and a good skimmer, but you still have to be very mindful of territorial behaviors.

[billysgirl4e]

Thanks, Nick!
As usual appreciate the advice very much. The gentleman I got it from said he never had a problem with levels from his set-up, so I'll just make sure to clean it if I start seeing a ligh level of nitrates (since I've already got it hooked up). Will that be an alright course of action?
-J Bishop

[Nick]

That sounds good, did he have a reef, or a fish only setup? Most people will let fish only tanks have much higher nitrates than reefs, and most puffers tolerate way less nitrates than a most FO setups have longterm.

[billysgirl4e]

I can't say I know the answer to that. But I would assume FOWLR, because he had 3 full spectrum lights (haven't looked what kind), but only used two of them. Had LR and LS... but that could go either way. Since there were no additives he gave me w/ all his fish things, again - I would assume FO. But you never know! LOL
Good point, though...

[Pufferpunk]

There is no inch/g rule, even in FW--it only applys to inch-long fish.

[billysgirl4e]

I knew there was no inch/g rule, but I've heard people say that if you have more than one fish in a tank the full amount can be less (ie 1 gsp is supposed to be in 30g minimum, but you can have 2 gsps in a 55?)
I hope that made sense...if it did, is there a hard and fast rule to any of that?

[cobra1713]

no stocking a marine tank can get tricky and it all depends on the kind of filtration and how well it is working. i agree with nick, if you have a sump i would look into changing the wet/dry into a Deep sand bed that will remove nitrates, or you could change a section of the sump into a refugium that has a DSB, heres a really good article on refugiums in sumps, it can really help with nitrate removal.

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2008- ... /index.php

[billysgirl4e]

I was originally planning a FOWLR tank, so I'm not so worried about it - but are there some species of coral that would be okay still? Maybe w/ tobies?

[cobra1713]

it depends on your lighting, you have a 75 gallon and you really need about 3-4 watts per gallon, but then again you said its a 48" tank which means its pretty tall so you would need pretty intense lighting to put corals near the bottom. but other thank lighting are you planning on stocking a puffer? they can eat a clean up crew which is very helpful with a reef tank. and they can possible eat corals, but the canthigaster which would prob be the best for your size tank prob wouldnt eat most of the softies, like mushrooms and leathers which are also pretty easy to keep. but lighting is the big thing its expensive! look for a used t-5 fixture or maybe even metal halide if you can find one cheap enough

[cobra1713]

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... atid=12109

is a power compact system you could get the 48" sysytem tat has 4x65 watt power compact bulbs. or if you have a bit more money something like this...


http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... atid=18700

but there are tons of other fixtures out there but those are just a place to start, i would look used first but also consider the fact that if you buy used chances are you will have to buy new bulbs fairly soon, and that new fixtures almost always come with brand new bulbs so on a system that has 4 power comact bulbs that can be anywere from 40- 80+ dollars to replace the bulbs

[MTV]

Ok with regards to lighting, I think you guys are going about it the wrong way. So often people try to put a rule of "watts per gallon" to reef aquariums and the fact of the matter is, it ain't that simple. Power compacts for instance, don't have the penetrating power required for tanks of more than 1' of depth. T5s have that penetrating power, but aren't strong enough to fuel the photosynthetic bacteria in some of the more demanding corals (read, SPS). Metal halides provide light strong enough for just about any coral but generate a lot of heat and are expensive to run. As a result, I would suggest basing your lighting requirements around what you want to keep, not some generic rule.

Should you want to run a FO or FOWLR tank, then PC's (power compacts) are fine. They are cheap to run, cheap to buy and can give an aesthetically pleasing, blanket lighting approach. Not appropriate for a tank of your size to grow corals though.

Should you want to run a tank with soft corals and/or LPS, then T5's are appropriate for your tank. Slightly more expensive but far and away more appropriate for sustaining corals of low to moderate lighting requirements. If you plan to keep LPS though, I would suggest going with a T5HO fixture in order to maximise your chances of keeping the corals in good health.

If SPS and a full-blown reef tank is what you desire, don't even consider (unless you are an advanced aquarist) anything short of a 150w metal halide for a tank of 2' depth or less. Then I'd be looking at 250-400w for anything more.

Then you need to take into account lighting spectrums. I would say that light in the 10,000K spectrum is fine for just fish. If you want to keep coral and have them be as healthy as possible (not to mention also view them to their full potential) then I would recommend a combination of lighting in the 14,000K and 20,000K spectrum.

[cobra1713]

i use thw "watts per gallon" rule because it is simple.

while i know that for different corals you need different light, she was stating prob doing a FOWLR tank so i was trying to give a starter ideas of what to look for with lighting, and for the most part aiming for 3-4 watts per gallon will give you good lighting, yes the ultimate set up would have metal halide on all my tanks but thats not practical, especially if you live in a hot climate and would have to purchase and run a chiller on a tank. so PC and T5 lighting are sufficient in most cases!,

and if she is planning on growing sps corals there is alot more to them then just lighting, the amount of nutrients and proteins in the water along with being able to keep the tank low enough in nitrates would usually require either an insane amount of water changes or implement a DSB fuge with a large amount a cheato algae, which she would have to let mature for a few months before it would properly filter enough nitrates, so in the mean time she would still need a thick sand bed in the tank seeded with live sand along with live rock and a very consistant water change schedule and a great skimmer and greatbalance in the tank for a new tank, so if she is worried about lighting as a big deal for growing sps's, lighting is the least of your worries in a large sps tank, IMO the challeng would be to get a mature and balanced tank that is stable enough to support such a delicate coral without much human intervention.

and as far as spectrum goes i agree but if your just doing softies then i wouldnt really worry about trying to find 20k lighting 14k or 10k is fine

[Pufferpunk]

BTW--IMO, 2 adult GSPs in a 55g is pushing it.

[billysgirl4e]

Thanks, Jeni. Not something I would try personally, anyway. Just a common example I hear about. I was going to do 2 gsps in my 65g hex, but Nick said that they'd be too terriorial together. I have another post about it. Any ideas of what I could put w/ my GSP in my 65?

Also - I'm not sure how we got off on lighting quite so much. Certainly not there for another couple of months. But just to clear the air here, the tank came with 2 coralife t-12 20,000k's, and an unidentified 3rd optional light (separate post about that one, too). This post was originally regarding the stocking of the tank and what I should have in it. Certainly still open to suggestions. (There's another posting for this, too - I'm trying to keep to one topic per posting, because of my tendency to ramble....)

Love you all!
Thanks so much for your continued help and patience to this rather new, but extremely avid, hobbiest. (Okay...hobby is probably not the right word - I was vacationing w/ my parents and asked my father if we should take my hubby to the local aquarium, and then I was like, "oh, wait, maybe not....that's all he ever hears about - and where all his money goes"...teeheehee....crazed and obsessed is probably a better word.

-Jessica