Umbrella has taken a step into Saltwater...

[Umbrella]

I did my homework on setting up tanks, cycling and all that jazz. The tank/parameters are all excellent. I have no idea which SW fish are good tank mates and all that. I know nothing about pretty much every SW fish including puffers... because I have been focusing on Fresh/Brackish. I know tons about FW/BW Puffs and fish.. but nada when it comes to SW... so here I am, askin you guys

I picked out just one little fish to be my SW fish. It is a 55 gal. and I plan on adding some corals and such..maybe a starfish or something... basically I just want the tank to be as close to home as possible for this little guy and I don't care how much $$ it costs to set up, cause I plan to do this in stages. Now when I was lookin for a resident for my tank, I had many choices but I think in the end I got the one that best suits me. Keep in mind I told myself I could only pick one of the following. No more ! Lol.

These were my choices:
( DQ = Disqualified for consideration )

Porcupine Puffer (Diodon Holocanthus) $29.99 <---- A lot of people have these, so they kinda lose their flare. ( DQ )
Spiny Box Puffer (Chilomycterus Schoepfi) $49.99 <--- Not in Pedia ? ( DQ )
Midnight Dog Faced Puffer (Arothron Nigropunctatus) $139.99 <---- Very beautiful, but I don't think I'm ready for him ( DQ )
Dog Faced Puffer (Arothron Nigropunctatus) $39.99 <--- These are like a dime a dozen there, none looked healthy ( DQ )
Narrow Lined Puffer (Arothron Manilensis) $49.99 <--- Was healthy and beautiful, but they had him marked as a Stars and stripes... I tried to tell them they were incorrect and I was looking for a Narrow Lined Puffer, but they insisted it was Stars and Stripes. I even told the guy to LOOK at the fish. It has stripes yes, but where the F are his stars ?? The dude just gave me some lame excuse.. so I also DQ'ed him to spite the sales guy. ( DQ ) He was a very beautiful fish tho
Blue Spot Puffer ? (Canthigaster papua) $29.99 <--- I don't know if it really was a C. Papua, I'm guessing cause thats what it looks closest to. Anyways, I am not a huge fan of Canthigasters but after seeing how miserable these 2 looked.. I kinda like them a little more now, however these 2 were not doing so good. Which sucks, because usually these guys take really good care of their fish... they just flub the names sometimes. Plus I can't find a match in the Pedia, so sadly another ( DQ )
Valentini Puffer (Canthigaster valentini) $16.99 <--- Like I said, I'm not a huge fan of Canthigasters, plus my last choice was way cooler so... ( DQ )

That was it for Puffs... and I had not selected anything yet..lol, I DQ'ed all of them. Problem. I have a perfectly ready to go tank and no one to put in it So I took another stroll around and stumbled across two more possible candidates.

Longhorn Cowfish (Lactoria cornuta) $29.99 <--- Very cute little fishy, but this one was born with only one horn. I was going to buy him because he was unique, lol he was more of a Unicorn fish than a Cowfish. Either way, he was already sold. ( DQ )
Cubicus Boxfish (Ostracion cubicus) $29.99 <--- So cute and very interesting to watch. Kind of shy, but hey! I think I found my fish! They had 2 but I only took one, then I advised them that keeping 2 of them in one 29 gal. wasn't a great idea. I read that if they are frightened enough they can release their toxin (ostracitoxin) directly into the water and kill everything, including themselves. Normally in nature the toxin wouldn't kill the boxfish.. but since in an aquarium the toxin has nowhere to go... it can be fatal without water changes. So.. I bought 1 of the 2. I picked one that has spots IN his eye, which I thought was weird. I didn't know spots could form IN their eyes. He is very very cute and I will Def. post a few pics of him ( even tho he isn't a puffer, he is close enough). He is freaking square ! Thats awesome, lol. He appears to move slower than a puffer, but he has WAY better maneuverability.

Now that you heard my story and you know which fish I selected, here is my question to you experienced SW peoples:

IF I were going to purchase a FEW, like no more than 5 other FISH, (crabs etc.. dont count) which ones would you recommend? Keep in mind he is SLOW moving and I don't want anything in there that could potentially scare him into releasing the ostracitoxin OR anything that will prevent him from eating by stealing his food. I was considering getting like 2 or 3 clown fish... but I have no idea if they are mean or what. Would you say that 2 - 3 Clown fish would be fine with him, or would you recommend I keep just the boxfish all by himself or go with a different fish? I really like the Mandarin's also, but once again I have no idea if they are mean etc.. I have no prob. keeping him alone if needed, but I'd like to give him some other creatures to mingle with.

I am going to put in corals, crabs, snails, and such and no, I don't mind if the lil Boxfish eats the corals. You might think I am crazy for saying that, but I feel that IF they eat corals in the wild, then coral must be a vital part of their diet and therefore I shouldn't rob him of that privilege.

With all of that said, I leave the floor to you. Please help me out I want to have the happiest little Boxfish, that is my only goal.

Thank you in advance to all who read this and respond,

-UMB

[yunachin]

I would get docile fish like Anthias or Gobies. If you want a clown get a Tomato or a Percula. Don't get any Maroons or Clarkii's as they get massive AND they have nasty little attitudes. Damsels as well are mean and like to torment. Psuedochromis might work too.

[Umbrella]

I would get docile fish like Anthias or Gobies. If you want a clown get a Tomato or a Percula. Don't get any Maroons or Clarkii's as they get massive AND they have nasty little attitudes. Damsels as well are mean and like to torment. Psuedochromis might work too.

Ok, TY for the advice Yunachin. I just have a few extra questions now if you or someone else don't mind. I took a look at the Anthias, but it mentioned that they have a complex social structure and only recommend 1 per tank... so does that mean that they are only mean to their own kind ?

As for gobies, I have some Bumble bee and fan dancers in brackish. Normally they are peaceful, but I have witnessed them being mean when food enters the equation ( as food always does ). So, are there any SPECIFIC species of goby you recommend /( like you did with the clown fish ) Because as we all know with puffers, each species has a diff. temperment, so I'd like the most peaceful Gobies I can get. For example I am pretty sure I saw a video of an engineer goby freak out and kill another fish. I had no idea gobies could be so vicious, but there are like 400+ kinds of goby or something like that so its not impossible. So would ya say Engineer Gobies are not a good idea ? Cause they look pretty cool.

What category does the Mandarin fall under ? Is it a goby ? And what about blennies ? Are they mean ?

I figure if I want to get some more aggressive ones I can set up another tank, but I'd like just a couple peaceful fish for now. I sorry I'm asking like a million questions here, but I'm new to the SW world. Im lookin to build a reef tank with lots of inverts and just a few fish, with the Star of the tank being Mr. Boxfish. I want the Boxfish to be happy more than anything else, but I also want him to have his own little reef... something as close as I can get to where he came from.

This is what I plan on sticking in there at the moment, just let me know if there is something I shouldn't ( and a reason if you have one ):

1 Cubicus Boxfish (Ostracion Cubicus) <--- He is already in the tank
1 Catalina Goby (Lythrypnus dalli)
1 Court Jester Goby (Amblygobius rainfordi)
1 Green Mandarin (Synchiropus splendidus)
1 Spotted Mandarin (Synchiropus picturatus)
1 True Percula Clownfish (Amphiprion percula) <--- DQ'ed if potentailly mean.
1 Arrow Crab (Stenorhynchus seticornis) <--- DQ if too fragile, I really like them but don't want to chance losing one.

----Other live inhabitants who may or may not get eaten but should help build the ecosystem/reef--------

4 Emerald Mithrax Crab (Mithrax sculptus)
4 Dwarf Zebra Hermit Crab (Calcinus laevimanus)
1 Tiger Tail Sea Cucumber (Holothuria sp.)
1-2 Feather Duster (Sabellastarte sp.)
1 Green Lettuce Sea Slug (Tridachia crispata)
1 Sea Hare (Aplysia sp.)
1 Sand Sifting Sea Star (Astropecten polycanthus)
5 Peppermint Shrimp (Lysmata wurdemanni)
2 Camel Shrimp (Rhynchocinetes durbanensis)
1 Blue Tuxedo Pincushion Urchin (Mespilia globulus) <--- I love sea urchins Def. want some.
1 Black Longspine Urchin (Diadema setosum)
1 Pencil Urchin (Eucidaris tribuloides)
Various Corals/Polyps
Various snails

Instead of one of the Gobies above I might go with a Horseface Blenny (Ophioblennius atlanticus) but first I need to find out if Blennies are meanies.

I think Seahorses are too fragile and the boxfish might kill them... tho 1 or 2 would be awesome, yes / no ?

Oh yea.. and Anemones would kill the boxfish should he get too curious right ? Or am I thinking of the wrong creature ?

Anyways, what you think. Seems good or do I need to change some things ? It doesn't seem like too many creatures in there does it ?

Once again I apologize for asking like 15,000 questions and thanks in advance for your help

-UMB

[Pufferpunk]

Forget the Manderins--you need a well-established tank & a refugium, as they mostly only eat live pods.

[yunachin]

Ok, TY for the advice Yunachin. I just have a few extra questions now if you or someone else don't mind. I took a look at the Anthias, but it mentioned that they have a complex social structure and only recommend 1 per tank... so does that mean that they are only mean to their own kind ?
****You can have groups of Anthias, or one, whichever your choice. I have 3 Lyretails currently, 1 male and 2 females. There is no aggression whatsoever to each other or other members of the tank.***

As for gobies, I have some Bumble bee and fan dancers in brackish. Normally they are peaceful, but I have witnessed them being mean when food enters the equation ( as food always does ). So, are there any SPECIFIC species of goby you recommend /( like you did with the clown fish ) Because as we all know with puffers, each species has a diff. temperment, so I'd like the most peaceful Gobies I can get. For example I am pretty sure I saw a video of an engineer goby freak out and kill another fish. I had no idea gobies could be so vicious, but there are like 400+ kinds of goby or something like that so its not impossible. So would ya say Engineer Gobies are not a good idea ? Cause they look pretty cool.
***Yellow Spotted Watchman Gobies are always a saltwater favorite, as they are docile and don't spend their entire time hidden. Also neon blue gobies are quite easy.***

What category does the Mandarin fall under ? Is it a goby ? And what about blennies ? Are they mean ?
***Beautuful fish but require and established source of isopods via a refugium that has been set up over a year. Not something that you would want to get into now.***

I figure if I want to get some more aggressive ones I can set up another tank, but I'd like just a couple peaceful fish for now. I sorry I'm asking like a million questions here, but I'm new to the SW world. Im lookin to build a reef tank with lots of inverts and just a few fish, with the Star of the tank being Mr. Boxfish. I want the Boxfish to be happy more than anything else, but I also want him to have his own little reef... something as close as I can get to where he came from.

This is what I plan on sticking in there at the moment, just let me know if there is something I shouldn't ( and a reason if you have one ):

1 Cubicus Boxfish (Ostracion Cubicus) <--- He is already in the tank
1 Catalina Goby (Lythrypnus dalli)
1 Court Jester Goby (Amblygobius rainfordi)
1 Green Mandarin (Synchiropus splendidus)
1 Spotted Mandarin (Synchiropus picturatus)
1 True Percula Clownfish (Amphiprion percula) <--- DQ'ed if potentailly mean.
1 Arrow Crab (Stenorhynchus seticornis) <--- DQ if too fragile, I really like them but don't want to chance losing one.

**No madarins. The Percula will be fine. Crab may or may not be food for Mr. Boxfish. Catalina gobies need a lower temp in the tank that may not coincide with what you have. Yes on Rainfordi Goby. ALSO I forgot earlier, you can look into cardinal fish, they are absolutely non-aggressive and nice to look at. Bangaii Cardinals are really handsome looking. I have a Pajama Cardinal.***

----Other live inhabitants who may or may not get eaten but should help build the ecosystem/reef--------

4 Emerald Mithrax Crab (Mithrax sculptus) **Have been known to attack small fish like gobies**
4 Dwarf Zebra Hermit Crab (Calcinus laevimanus) **ok**
1 Tiger Tail Sea Cucumber (Holothuria sp.)**Very difficult to keep alive and requires much water flow**
1-2 Feather Duster (Sabellastarte sp.) **You will find that over time these grow on their own**
1 Green Lettuce Sea Slug (Tridachia crispata)**Another very difficult animal that has only a few month lifespan**
1 Sea Hare (Aplysia sp.) **Same as above**
1 Sand Sifting Sea Star (Astropecten polycanthus) *ok*
5 Peppermint Shrimp (Lysmata wurdemanni)
2 Camel Shrimp (Rhynchocinetes durbanensis)
1 Blue Tuxedo Pincushion Urchin (Mespilia globulus) <--- I love sea urchins Def. want some.**Be wary as they will destroy everything they come across, rolling around that is.**
1 Black Longspine Urchin (Diadema setosum)**Not good with the cowfish as they spines are likely to be bit off**
1 Pencil Urchin (Eucidaris tribuloides)**Same as above**
Various Corals/Polyps **Good beginner corals are mushrooms. leathers and xenias.**
Various snails

Instead of one of the Gobies above I might go with a Horseface Blenny (Ophioblennius atlanticus) but first I need to find out if Blennies are meanies.
*Not mean, just need established pods like mentioned above. Best to wait on this one.**

I think Seahorses are too fragile and the boxfish might kill them... tho 1 or 2 would be awesome, yes / no ?
**Hard to keep as they need a diet of live brine shrimp...IMO best left in a tank of their own species.**

Oh yea.. and Anemones would kill the boxfish should he get too curious right ? Or am I thinking of the wrong creature ?
**Anemones and boxfish, puffers, dont mix. They also require strong lights and good water current. Best to wait on this as well.**

Anyways, what you think. Seems good or do I need to change some things ? It doesn't seem like too many creatures in there does it ?

Once again I apologize for asking like 15,000 questions and thanks in advance for your help

**Not a problem with all the questions. It's best that you are getting the knowledge before going out and just buying a whole bunch of incompatible things then tossing them all in together and expecting them to survive.**

[FishFan]

I know you dq'ed the Narrow Lined puffer, but if you saw a lively specimen, you may wish to reconsider if you have the room; we really like ours. We've only had our 2" guy for a couple of weeks, but he's fearless; he jumps out of the water to grab his food (we discovered this accidentally), will bob on the surface to watch us, and follows us whenever we're in the room. According to http://wetwebmedia.com/tetraodontpuffers.htm , although they can get up to 12", they normally get about 6" in captivity. He's been living with our 1" Tetrosomus gibbosus (Pyramid/ Hovercraft/ Helmet/ Thorned Cowfish) in the qt, and they get along fine (KOW).

We've had good luck with common cleaner shrimp with a few of our puffers, but so far, that's the only inverts that haven't ended up as a midnight snack, so I can't comment on any of the others listed.

[StormySkiez]

Is that him in your new avatar? What a darling fish!

[FishFan]

Is that him in your new avatar? What a darling fish!

That's our spiny boxfish. We're unsure on species, but he came from Liveaquaria Diver's Den as Chilomycterus schoepfi. Really sweet, laid-back little guy.

We captured our A. manilensis, Zooty, in action a couple of days ago sticking his head out of the water dolphin-style to investigate a finger.

ZootyBobber.jpg

I found out not watching too close during a wc that he'll do more than look.

So Umbrella, where's pics of your new fishie?

~Anne

[StormySkiez]

Ah, I saw the box fish and mixed up who was who .

Anxiously waiting for photos Umbrella .

[bonnie3188]

Id definately get a blenny for the tank. They eat algae and have great personalities and aren't agressive at all. I love my Bi-Colour blenny, and also have a Lawnmower blenny that does a great job cleaning algae but is pretty big and a bit ugly.

[Pufferpunk]

Do lawnmowers eat hair algae?

[Nick]

Algae blenny's are cute-ugly, they have that "frog face" appeal...

[yunachin]

Do lawnmowers eat hair algae?

Yes, they are supposed to. Some do and some don't though. Kind of like the Copperbands eating aiptasia.

[SpockthePuffer]

Do lawnmowers eat hair algae?

I saw a video of one chowing down on hair algae like a cow eating grass in a field, it was amazing

[Pufferpunk]

I'm gonna get one tomorrow then.