pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

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razzledazzlebee
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pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

Post by razzledazzlebee »

My 12 gallon tank was cycled at freshwater, so I took out the filler fish this morning and brought them and the water sample to the LFS. It tested at 7.8 Ph, 0 Ammonia, 0 Nitrite, .25 Nitrate. They advised that I add instant ocean. I took 50% water from the tank, mixed it with 1 cup of the salt in a bucket first then added it to the tank. This brought the salinity to 1.006. I need to get it up around 10 or 12, so I repeated the process again with just 1/4 cup of salt in about 20% water change. This brought the salinity to 1.008. I then added some fresh water with a little more instant ocean (like 1/8 cup) then tested later. The salinity is now up to 1.009. The cartridge for the filter looked icky (kind of greenish/yellowish on the blue cartridge- It's an Eclipse system with a bio-wheel) so I replaced it with a fresh one. I have a little pH and ammonia reader thing stuck and the inside of the tank which had previously read 8.2 pH (the store tested it at 7.8 ) and 0 ammonia. Now it is reading 6.6 pH and 0.2 ammonia! I know I drastically changed the tank conditions with the salt, but I didn't think that would affect pH or ammonia!
As I'm typing this I'm realizing that the big difference must be the filter cartridge. I just put the old one back in there and I'll check in the morning to see if that helps the situation. I'm just glad I don't have my fishy home yet! :O If all looks good in the morning I will let you guys know, and I'll take the sample into the LFS just in case to make sure. I was planning to use Bio-Spira tonight to help replace the good bacteria that may have died, but pufferpunk advised against it, saying I should add it with the fish. However, I'm concerned that without the Bio-Spira the tank will not re-cycle.... It has fish waste in there still since I just took out the previous inhabitants and kept the same water. Any advice would be appreciated!
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Pufferpunk
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Re: pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

Post by Pufferpunk »

What I'd do, is leave the new filter pad in there & get the SG down to about 1.008. Then you can be sure the B-S will work OK in that tank. Just add it at the same time as the puffer. You can drip acclimate the puffer to the lower SG.

I have no idea why your pH has gone so low, unless the ammonia has made the water acidic. Adding salt should actually make the pH higher, because it has buffers in it. What are you using for substrate? Should be crushed coral or aragonite sand. This will also help buffer the pH & keep it steady, around 8.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...

"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
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Pufferpunk
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Posts: 32764
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 11:06 am
Gender: Female
My Puffers: Filbert, the 12" T lineatus
Punkster, the 4" red T miurus
Mongo, the 4" A modestus
2 T biocellatus
C valentini
C coranata
C papuan
Also kept:
lorteti
DPs
suvattii
burrfish
T niphobles
Location (country): USA, Greenville, SC
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Re: pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

Post by Pufferpunk »

Also, be sure the B-S has been kept refrigerated from the time it was made to the time it's going into the tank. I guess you'll have to take the shop's word on that.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...

"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
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razzledazzlebee
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Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 12:45 am
Location: Lynden, WA, USA

Re: pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

Post by razzledazzlebee »

OK, so I should put the new cartridge back in? I'll do that now.
I am using crushed shells as the substrate.
Oops, I meant to say ammonia is at .02 instead of .2 :shock:
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razzledazzlebee
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Location: Lynden, WA, USA

Re: pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

Post by razzledazzlebee »

Yes, I'm pretty sure it's been refrigerated. I have it in my fridge now, and the shop was very adamant about "keep it refrigerated!" They are a pretty good LFS (hey, they keep brackish puffers in brackish water which is more than I can say about a lot of shops) and they specialize in just fish.
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Pufferpunk
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Posts: 32764
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 11:06 am
Gender: Female
My Puffers: Filbert, the 12" T lineatus
Punkster, the 4" red T miurus
Mongo, the 4" A modestus
2 T biocellatus
C valentini
C coranata
C papuan
Also kept:
lorteti
DPs
suvattii
burrfish
T niphobles
Location (country): USA, Greenville, SC
Location: Chicago
Contact:

Re: pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

Post by Pufferpunk »

Sounds like a good shop! What kind of filter are you using? I tend to shy away from the kind with removable cartridges, as you remove a lot of the good bacteria with them. I definately would recommend AquaClear filters over them. They have a rinsable, reusable sponge (rinsed bi-weekly), you can pack filter floss in there to "polish" the water (thrown out monthly) & even BioMax ceramic rings, for extra biological filtration (rinsed about every 2-3 months).

Is your substrate actual small shells? you'll have to clean that very thoroughly, for bits of food. Although attractive, I'm afraid it might not be the best for that tank (or any tank for that matter). It will be difficult to use a gravel cleaner on it, as they will get sucked up but that is the best way to clean large pieces of substrate like that, to be sure you get all the food out of it.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...

"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
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razzledazzlebee
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Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 12:45 am
Location: Lynden, WA, USA

Re: pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

Post by razzledazzlebee »

It is a penguin filter, but it's all built into the hood with the lights so I can't put a drop-behind filter on the tank. The nice thing is that there's no way for the fish to jump out- it's all enclosed except for a tiny strip to let power cords out (less than 1/2" tall). I've had good experiences with the bio-wheel technology in the past.
The substrate was recommended by the LFS, saying ti would help with the pH. Yes, it is small shells but doesn't get sucked up with my siphon the couple of times I've put it in the gravel.
Good news! Ammonia is down to 0 again, I can't tell with the pH meter if it's at 6.6 or 7.4. I'm taking a sample into the LFS today before I pick up my fish, so I can see. I'm considering buying a kit in the future, when the stick-on one expires (it says 6-8 weeks on the package).
I'll post picks when I get her home! :lol: My cats are so excited about watching their new TV! :catfish:
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Pufferpunk
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Posts: 32764
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 11:06 am
Gender: Female
My Puffers: Filbert, the 12" T lineatus
Punkster, the 4" red T miurus
Mongo, the 4" A modestus
2 T biocellatus
C valentini
C coranata
C papuan
Also kept:
lorteti
DPs
suvattii
burrfish
T niphobles
Location (country): USA, Greenville, SC
Location: Chicago
Contact:

Re: pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

Post by Pufferpunk »

Always best to have your own kits. I'd do a large (80%) WC before adding the B-S.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...

"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
User avatar
razzledazzlebee
Puffer Fry
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 12:45 am
Location: Lynden, WA, USA

Re: pH Down, Ammonia up with Saltwater addition

Post by razzledazzlebee »

I took the water in and it looks like my stick on tester is WAY off. pH was 8.0, ammonia 0, nitrites 0, nitrates .5. Way better than it looked according to the stick on thing.
I got fishy home, dripped her and now she's in the tank. I just added the B-S. We decide to name her "Octavia" :) She's doing good, hunting for food already! I put a ghost shrimp in there and she tried attacking it right away. Just gotta find my camera...
Thanks for the help!
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