Figure Eight Puffer Mystery

OraLacerta · Post by **OraLacerta** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:07 pm

As some of you know, my Figure Eight 'Hindenburg' has been battling the bulge ever since I added more fish to his tank. I've had Hindy for about a year now. His new F8 puffer friend, Bismarck, was added to the 35 gallon about two weeks ago after being in QT with some mollies and my Knight Goby. Well, after these guys were added he got really fat. I noticed he started hoarding a lot of the food to himself, which is much different behavior than what he exhibited in the year I've had him.

Well I've started to feed the tank every 2 days instead of ever other day, but Hindy is just staying the same size. Today I saw what I thought was him eating sand. Well, I looked again over in his cave where I thought he was eating sand, and I was shocked to find a large cluster of white eggs!

I don't want to jump to any conclusions just yet, but that would explain why Hindy ballooned up after the new puff was introduced, and also why 'he' has been in his cave so much lately. The other fish are picking at the eggs but when Hindy comes back over to them he chases them away. Now, he could also be guarding his new found stash of food, or he could be protecting them. I'm going to take pics as soon as I find my camera!

OraLacerta · Post by **OraLacerta** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:18 pm

The pictures aren't coming out. The mollies are picking them off, but if they are puffer eggs Hindy looks like there will be lots more coming from there. If 'he' is the culprit and lays more eggs I'll scoop them out and take pics.

PS- Should I set up a new tank for Hindy if the eggs are puffer eggs so maybe they might survive?

Post by **RTR** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:19 pm

That is great! Photos! Please!

And water conditions, diet details, and, and...

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 5:07 pm

Woooohoooooo!

Post by **Hilly** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 5:16 pm

Awwww OL, you might become a puffer mummy. Fantastic.

Did Bismarck wine and dine Hindy before knocking her up.

OraLacerta · Post by **OraLacerta** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 5:39 pm

Ok, here's the water conditions:

SG 1.007
pH 7.8
Ammonia- 0
Nitrate- 0
Nitrites- 0
(just did a water change)
I ran out of my strips that test the other params but I'll get those stats up soon

*edited to add*

>Diet: Fed live snails weekly, I alternate SF Bay frozen foods every week, to give variety: Marine Cuisine, Emerald Entree, Krill, Blood Worms, Brine Shrimp, Mussels, Plankton, Squid.<

I just switched from Instant Ocean salt mix (when I set up the 35 gallon about a month ago) to Aquatic Gardens salt mix which, when using the same ratio of salt seems to have risen the SG slightly to 1.007.
Hindy was in a 15 gallon tall for all the time I've had him, and then I switched him to the heavily decorated tank with many caves.

Bismarck is slightly larger/older than Hindy (he's sleeker and longer) and has been bossed around a bit by Hindy recently. Before that they were getting along very well- even sharing the cave Hindy seems to be brooding in right now.

The only other changes I can think of are I lessened the current a little bit (removed the air wand) and I also changed from gravel to black sand to the tank about two weeks ago as well... Come to think of it I have made a lot of changes recently. Too many variables to really help explain why this is happening.

The pics I tried to take of the eggs is too blurry to be helpful as they seemed to have been hidden under the sand until the mollies discovered them and pulled a bunch out. As I tried and tried to get this Stupid *bleeping* camera to focus on them the other fish have been eating them!

This is inside the fake tree cave that Hindy was seen doing something in the sand. The pic has a molly or two in it, they've been picking at the eggs probably because of the feeding schedule I've had them on made them really hungry.

Here's the outside so you get an idea of where you were looking:

Here's Bismarck by the 'den' as I'm calling it, the white blurry stuff (so sorry for my terrible photography!) are some eggs being eaten by the other fish:

The eggs were all buried to the far left of this picture where you can see a yellow molly face; by the time I got a picture that wasn't totally black, the eggs had been picked apart. You can see some of the pieces. They were perfectly spherical white eggs that were all bonded together in a big buried clump and the mollies have been tearing them apart. I'm hoping that the rest are safe in the sand:

Here's how large Hindy has become; keep in mind this is the third day straight of not having anything to eat (the pictures aren't very good but I didn't want to keep scaring 'him' away from the den so I just settled for these):

Later tonight or tomorrow morning I'm going to try to have some better pics. I bet if these are puffer eggs there will be more of them. I'll also dig in the sand in the area where I saw them to see if indeed Hindy buried them. Keep in mind I just did a water change and stirred the sand up yesterday. There wasn't anything down there in the sand, whatever these are, someone buried them!

Cross your fingers all!

OraLacerta · Post by **OraLacerta** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:14 pm

Oh yeah, guys, any help is appreciated!!!

What do I do? Should I try digging for the eggs or leave them be? Should I try moving Hindy and the eggs to the 15 gallon??

I can't set up the tank by myself because I hurt my hand, so i'm going to have to wait on that until my Hubby can help. Do you think that the eggs are too sensitive to change tanks?? RTR? Help!

I can't do anything tonight so please anyone who's had puffer eggs or had an idea of what might be the best way to preserve them please chime in. I am still finding it hard to believe that they could be puffer eggs, but Hindy is the only fish in the tank that has swollen up before eggs appeared, and the only others, the gobies and the flounder, haven't been obsessing over in that area like Hindy has, and plus they haven't swollen up either.... this is so stressful!

OraLacerta · Post by **OraLacerta** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 9:14 pm

UPDATE

I just checked for more eggs, and I don't see any on the surface but I'll be extra watchful this week. I just talked to a friend who said it was really unusual that they were both buried & white and that most fish eggs are laid where currents will carry over them and prevent fungus (which incidentally causes eggs to turn white).

I'll post any new findings.

Post by **RTR** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:36 pm

Unfertile eggs may be white, but so may fertile ones early after deposition.

Fungused eggs look fuzzy. The saprophytic fungi in tanks are most often white.

Good notes, thanks.

OraLacerta · Post by **OraLacerta** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 9:51 am

Well, hopefully then they weren't fungused, they definitely didn't look fuzzy.

There don't seem to have been any more eggs laid, but then again if Hindy or whoever is burying them they might have been laid in a safer location. I'm also feeding everyone a bit more again to try to reduce the amount of eggs being eaten if more are laid.

The Fisherman · Post by **The Fisherman** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 2:04 pm

I wonder if its the slightly higher SG, combined with the right diet, and a male and female F8.

Very very interesting.

OraLacerta · Post by **OraLacerta** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 9:31 am

Ok, I decided to dig in the first area where I noticed the eggs, and I found some still down there.

I decided to take a small cluster out so I could photograph them becsuse if these are indeed F8 eggs then documenting them is important. I also couldn't get any focused pictures through the tank.

There they are. They look more yellow now than they did before, and more translucent. I'm not sure why the color has changed, but some of it may be because of the lighting outside of the tank; thought they were bright white before.

I wanted to add more things I remember:
I added Java Fern about 3 weeks ago (two small plants).
I began to feed a few more snails before the eggs appeared because my snail tank is starting to produce more.

The Fisherman · Post by **The Fisherman** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 7:51 pm

Those look like eggs to me...I think they may be fertile too

OraLacerta · Post by **OraLacerta** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 3:29 pm

Really??? Awesome! I've been getting my 15 gallon set up for them & in the meantime I have had the remaining eggs in a fry-net in the 35 gallon so no other fish eat them.

I'm hoping this will turn out- how cool would it be to have your fave. puffs babies!!!

Post by **Myaj** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:46 am

Since the puffers are obviously happy with the tank setup, wouldn't it work to remove the tankmates who are eating the eggs instead of trying to move the eggs? Just a thought..

This is just too cool, I really hope you get some fry hatched out!

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