Euthanasia
Forum rules
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
Read this before posting!!
Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.
1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.
2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.
3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)
4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.
5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.
We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.
While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.
Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.
Euthanasia
Any of you ever do it? You believe in taking it upon yourself to relieve an animal/fish from suffering? Do you just let them live it out? Discuss....
Re: Euthanasia
I worked for a place that would stick things in a freezer, still alive. But they assured me that they couldn't feel anything....
Re: Euthanasia
I've euthanized fish with MS-222 and clove oil. I don't let any of my animals go through unnecessary suffering. Ever. If there is little hope for survival then I let them go while they still have a decent quality of life (granted this is more difficult for fish). If it's something other than fish then the vet takes care of them.
It is absurd to talk of one animal being higher than another. We consider those, when the cerebral structure/intellectual faculties most developed, as highest. A bee doubtless would when the instincts were.
Charles Darwin
Charles Darwin
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goldielocke76
- Fahaka Puffer
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- Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 7:19 pm
- Location (country): California, USA
Re: Euthanasia
Flutter wrote:I've euthanized fish with MS-222 and clove oil. I don't let any of my animals go through unnecessary suffering. Ever. If there is little hope for survival then I let them go while they still have a decent quality of life (granted this is more difficult for fish). If it's something other than fish then the vet takes care of them.
+1. I used to work at a vet clinic and I have no problems saying that IMHO, it's quality over quantity. If I know my dog is suffering, I would never, ever, keep her here. I wouldn't be able to let her go through that. As long as she's healthy, happy and has a long life, when it's time to put her down, I won't like it, but I know I did everything I could. I have had to put 3 animals down growing up-- it's not pleasant, but seeing them suffer, for me, is always worse.
5.5g: Pond snails
5.5g: Red Cherry Shrimp and Rams
10g: PZ the Pee Wee (DP), Ghost shrimp, Otos x3
36g: Luau the F8, Zebra nerites x8, sometimes a herd of ghost shrimp for food
60g: Perches the starry blenny, 1 watchman goby Snaps the l.c. hermit, 2 emerald crabs, 1 red crab, 2 turbos, 7 asteas, 2 nerites, 2 clown gobies and 2 firefish gobies (upgrading to a 90 gallon reef)
RIP Yoshi, you are dearly missed <3
5.5g: Red Cherry Shrimp and Rams
10g: PZ the Pee Wee (DP), Ghost shrimp, Otos x3
36g: Luau the F8, Zebra nerites x8, sometimes a herd of ghost shrimp for food
60g: Perches the starry blenny, 1 watchman goby Snaps the l.c. hermit, 2 emerald crabs, 1 red crab, 2 turbos, 7 asteas, 2 nerites, 2 clown gobies and 2 firefish gobies (upgrading to a 90 gallon reef)
RIP Yoshi, you are dearly missed <3
Re: Euthanasia
Define quality of life. I just wonder because the life of an aquarium fish seems pretty low quality.
Re: Euthanasia
Forget that. My dog will go at home, with me there. And then I'll get another one that looks just like him, cuz dogs are great like that.goldielocke76 wrote:Flutter wrote:I've euthanized fish with MS-222 and clove oil. I don't let any of my animals go through unnecessary suffering. Ever. If there is little hope for survival then I let them go while they still have a decent quality of life (granted this is more difficult for fish). If it's something other than fish then the vet takes care of them.
+1. I used to work at a vet clinic and I have no problems saying that IMHO, it's quality over quantity. If I know my dog is suffering, I would never, ever, keep her here. I wouldn't be able to let her go through that. As long as she's healthy, happy and has a long life, when it's time to put her down, I won't like it, but I know I did everything I could. I have had to put 3 animals down growing up-- it's not pleasant, but seeing them suffer, for me, is always worse.
Re: Euthanasia
Five freedoms (designed for livestock):
Freedom from thirst, hunger and malnutrition - by ready access to fresh water and a diet to maintain full health and vigor.
Freedom from discomfort - by providing a suitable environment including shelter and a comfortable resting area.
Freedom from pain, injury and disease - by prevention or rapid diagnosis and treatment.
Freedom to express normal behavior - by providing sufficient space, proper facilities and company of the animals own kind.
Freedom from fear and distress - by ensuring conditions that avoid mental suffering.
For my pets I go by personal judgement where the animal's welfare is the focus. That being said, I'd never keep an animal if I couldn't provide for it's 5 freedoms. IMO if an animal has all 5 of it's freedoms then it would have a good quality of life.
ETA: I had 2 dogs PTS last year and both were done at home. If you're a good client your vet should travel to your home. On both occasions I held the dogs while they were injected. I held their veins as well for the vet. Heartbreaking but both dogs were PTS where they laid down at home. Both were planned but we didn't even move the dogs from their location to let them go. Other than having them fall asleep and never wake up it was the best way for them to go.
Freedom from thirst, hunger and malnutrition - by ready access to fresh water and a diet to maintain full health and vigor.
Freedom from discomfort - by providing a suitable environment including shelter and a comfortable resting area.
Freedom from pain, injury and disease - by prevention or rapid diagnosis and treatment.
Freedom to express normal behavior - by providing sufficient space, proper facilities and company of the animals own kind.
Freedom from fear and distress - by ensuring conditions that avoid mental suffering.
For my pets I go by personal judgement where the animal's welfare is the focus. That being said, I'd never keep an animal if I couldn't provide for it's 5 freedoms. IMO if an animal has all 5 of it's freedoms then it would have a good quality of life.
ETA: I had 2 dogs PTS last year and both were done at home. If you're a good client your vet should travel to your home. On both occasions I held the dogs while they were injected. I held their veins as well for the vet. Heartbreaking but both dogs were PTS where they laid down at home. Both were planned but we didn't even move the dogs from their location to let them go. Other than having them fall asleep and never wake up it was the best way for them to go.
It is absurd to talk of one animal being higher than another. We consider those, when the cerebral structure/intellectual faculties most developed, as highest. A bee doubtless would when the instincts were.
Charles Darwin
Charles Darwin
Re: Euthanasia
Excellent guideline. Too bad people can't get that...
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El Scorpio
- Fahaka Puffer
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Re: Euthanasia
About a year after I returned home from the USMC my old dog was hit by a truck - quite deliberately, I might add. I live out in the country and there is no vet to take him to, but he was so badly injured he wouldn't of made it anyway. So, I had to handle it myself.
Re: Euthanasia
Dogs are sentient beings. They know things...El Scorpio wrote:About a year after I returned home from the USMC my old dog was hit by a truck - quite deliberately, I might add. I live out in the country and there is no vet to take him to, but he was so badly injured he wouldn't of made it anyway. So, I had to handle it myself.
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Pufferpunk
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Re: Euthanasia
Oh wow, that had to be really tough!
Kalvin tore up an opossum over the summer & hubby had to crush it's skull with a 2x4. I couldn't watch.
Kalvin tore up an opossum over the summer & hubby had to crush it's skull with a 2x4. I couldn't watch.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
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Dadof4
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Re: Euthanasia
I did this out of kindness for one of my dogs about 10 years ago. She was a rabbit hunter that loved to be in the woods and running all the time. She went in to liver failure at the age of 12, was dying slowly, was blind, and the vet wanted to put her down. I took her on one last hunting trip, she could barely stand at home but when she hit the ground in the woods the tail went up and the nose went to the ground and she started hunting. She died a very happy dog.El Scorpio wrote:About a year after I returned home from the USMC my old dog was hit by a truck - quite deliberately, I might add. I live out in the country and there is no vet to take him to, but he was so badly injured he wouldn't of made it anyway. So, I had to handle it myself.
"Darwin swings...annnnnnd a miss. Boy Jim, Chuck's suffered at the plate tonight. He's 0 for 3 and I'm not sure he's recovered from that shoulder pull a few weeks ago. I'll bet the front office is re-thinking that contract."
Re: Euthanasia
That's similar to what we did with the latest dog. At home she was clumsy and confused but out on a walk she was pulling on the leash, playing, trying to run around. A completely different dog. We took her for one last walk, when we got back she went to sleep. Once her HR returned to normal we woke her up with a bear hug and a needle 
It is absurd to talk of one animal being higher than another. We consider those, when the cerebral structure/intellectual faculties most developed, as highest. A bee doubtless would when the instincts were.
Charles Darwin
Charles Darwin
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Pufferpunk
- Queen Admin
- Posts: 32772
- Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 11:06 am
- Gender: Female
- My Puffers: Filbert, the 12" T lineatus
Punkster, the 4" red T miurus
Mongo, the 4" A modestus
2 T biocellatus
C valentini
C coranata
C papuan
Also kept:
lorteti
DPs
suvattii
burrfish
T niphobles - Location (country): USA, Greenville, SC
- Location: Chicago
- Contact:
Re: Euthanasia
The night before we put our last JRT down, she brought me her ball.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
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Jase
- Mbu Puffer
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- Location: Montana
Re: Euthanasia
I've never had a vet put my pet or any animal down... It's better done quick and done yourself. I know many people disagree, but that's the way I was raised. It's part of the responsibility you take when you take on a pet. Even with fish I've had, with out the details, I think it's more humanely done quick (no freezing or clove or what not). That said, I would give any animal every chance to survive, but will never let one suffer.
-Jase
edmlfc1 wrote:A house without a puffer is not a home.