Unhappy F8 Puffers

[Suni9]

Hi all,

I am new to the forum and new to fish keeping! I require some advice on my F8 puffers (I have 2 in a 94L/ 21G tank). The tank is a brackish set-up. My boyfriend and I ordered the fish approximately 7 weeks into the cycle. We thought that by the time the fish arrived, the tank would be fully cycled, unfortunately this was not the case. When we added the fish, the water parameters were as follows: PH 7.5+, Ammonia 0 ppm, Nitrite 1ppm, Nitrate 30 ppm. We were making 20L water changes every other day until we realised a couple of days ago that the nitrite levels in the tank had spiked. Our little puffer was looking gray on the belly, so we decided to carry out a larger water change - 30L. Shortly after the water change, the biggger puffer (the more active puffer of the two) curled up into a ball with the tail wrapped around him and sunk to the substrate - we honestly thought he had died! A few minutes later we managed to get him swimming around again. I googled the symptoms and read that this is a response to significant stress being placed on the puffer - i.e. large water changes, changes to the water parameters etc. Once again this morning, the nitrite levels were high in the tank. We added Sera Toxivec which was recommended by my local acquatic centre. This seemed to bring the toxic levels in the tank right down, but the larger puffer reacted in the same way.

I really love these little fish and I really want to provide them with the ideal water conditions to reside in. Can somebody please advise me on how I can get the levels all down to 0 whilst keeping my fish alive?! Apologies in advance for the very long message!

Thank you,
Suni

[Pufferpunk]

Your tank is too small for 2 F8s. Any way you can upgrade them to a larger tank? IMO, you should get the SG back to FW, so you can do a lot more larger daily WC on there. Don't worry about BW for now.

IDK what Sera Toxivec is but it's my guess this may be irritating your puffer. The chemical you should be adding is Prime to condition the water & detoxify ammonia/nitrite.

[bertie 83]

Welcome to the forum. +1 to the above. Once at fresh water add a bottle of safestart to your filter ( switched off of course), safestart will help you out a lot

[RTR]

Another +1 to Pufferpunks's advice above. That tank is simply too small for the two fish. Unfortunately few LFS know how to handle puffers.

[Master of Puffers]

IDK what Sera Toxivec is but it's my guess this may be irritating your puffer. The chemical you should be adding is Prime to condition the water & detoxify ammonia/nitrite.

Google tells me it's a water conditioner

[Pufferpunk]

...and much more...

[RTR]

Unfortunately, anything which promises fewer water changes and says it removes all dangerous pollutants is kidding itself and lying to you. Water changes do not just remome by dilution dangerous materials, they are equally important in replacing many and replenishing many required materials which the fish require for health and life.

[Iliveinazoo]

The tank is almost spot on what the Pufferpedia used to recommend, I.e 15(US)G for the first + 10(US)G for the 2nd?

I'd follow Bertie's advice and add Tetra safestart to instantly cycle the tank.

[Pufferpunk]

How is a 21g tank (which is really only about 18g tops, of water) the same as a MINIMUM of 25g for 2?

[RTR]

Some of us (who also happen to have a lot of experience with F-8s) will not keep two of them in less than a 33XL, and prefer to use a 40-long for the best chance of long-term compatibility. For that matter, I will not keep even one in a 20 other than for QT, and prefer to us at least a 20-long for better swimming room. I do freely admit to generally using significantly larger tanks for housing most of my fish than many folks do. But somehow or other, my fish do tend to live longer than most other folks fish do. Tank space and water volumes are IME directly related to lifespan, as are good diets and clean water along with minimum stress.

Personal choice selections, the decisions are yours.

[Iliveinazoo]

Because you get more water to a UK Gallon than a US Gallon. Just like you get more zeros to a UK billion than a US billion.

[bertie 83]

It's likely a 90l tank? Which is 20 uk gallons

[Iliveinazoo]

Or a 100 litre

The OP quoted 94l = ~25(US)G & ~21(UK)G

[Suni9]

Thank you to everyone that has posted.

I do live in the UK and it was recommended that we have 15 gallons for 1 F8 puffer + another 10 gallons for every additional puffer that is added. The tank is about 21 gallons, so its nearly there size-wise. The puffers seem to be doing ok together and have established their territories in the tank.

I went to my local acquatic center and told them the situation with the tank. Unfortunately they didn't have any Prime (I think this is a US product?) however they did suggest that I carry out smaller daily water changes 15-20% and add beneficial bacteria (Microbe-Lift) along with Sera Toxivec to deal with the nitrites in the water.

Since I originally posted, my boyfriend and I noticed that the smaller F8 puffer had worms and so have treated both puffers for this. All of the changes so far have been positive, we are controlling the water in the tank until the nitrite spike is over and the puffers are looking much happier and more active. It's such a joy to see them actually enjoying themselves rather than looking down and unwell. Fingers crossed that all of the water parameters settle in the next week and that we can start worrying less and enjoying the fish more!

Thank you for all of your advice again!

Suni9 + 2x F8's (Lilly & Bam-Bam)