Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

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Since this board has been up, we have found there are several questions that routinely get asked in order to help diagnose problems. If you can have that information to begin with in your post, we'll be able to help right away (if we can!) without having to wait for you to post the info we need.

1) Your water parameters - pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrates and salinity (if appropriate). This is by far the most important information you can provide! Do not answer this with "Fine" "Perfect" "ok", that tells us nothing. We need hard numbers.

2) Tank size and a list of ALL inhabitants. Include algae eaters, plecos, everything. We need to know what you have and how big the tank is.

3) Feeding, water change schedule and a list of all products you are using or have added to the tank (examples: Cycle, Amquel, salt, etc)

4) What changes you've made in the tank in the last week or so. Sometimes its the little things that make all the difference.

5) How long the aquarium has been set up, and how did you cycle it? If you don't know what cycling is read this: Fishless Cycling Article and familiarize yourself with all the information. Yes. All of it.

We want to help, and providing this information will go a LONG way to getting a diagnosis and hopeful cure that much faster.

While you wait for assistance:
One of the easiest and best ways to help your fish feel better is clean water! If you are already on a regular water change schedule (50% weekly is recommended) a good step to making your fish more comfortable while waiting for diagnosis/suggestions is to do a large water change immediately. Feel free to repeat daily or as often as you can, clean water is always a good thing! Use of Amquel or Prime as a dechlor may help with any ammonia or nitrite issues, and is highly recommended.

Note - if you do not normally do large water changes, doing a sudden, large water change could shock your fish by suddenly changing their established water chemistry. Clean water is still your first goal, so in this case, do several smaller (10%) water changes over the next day or two before starting any large ones.

Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby Terrance on Mon May 28, 2012 5:00 pm

I've seen reading some stuff off of MFK about Fahakas from certain regions of the world being smaller at max size. I'm not sure if my guy is from that region or not.

In December 2011, my puff was 2". Today he measures slightly longer than 4". Its been five months, but he has only grown 2 inches. I treated for IPs twice (each lasting about a week). During treatment, he didn't really eat too much of the medicated food (take one bite of the medicated food) and had stringy poop.

Currently, his poop is no longer stringy (none that I've seen so far), but solids. I feed worms, snails, and raw shrimp (vitachem). I feed until the tummy is slightly rounded once per day, 6 days per week. Before each meal, I see his body being slender, but not really sunken. Recently after a day of fasting, his tummy did look slightly sunken. I notice if he eats too much, there would be areas on his tummy that bulges out.

Is this normal for a 4" Fahaka? Here is a video of me showing you what happens when I overfeed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZvePRWg ... ature=plcp
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby bertie 83 on Mon May 28, 2012 5:07 pm

Ip's. Medicated food soaked in garlic will get munched. I will not go on that site. They should grow 1" a month
It's amazing how easy maintenance is. If done regularly and thoroughly
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby Terrance on Mon May 28, 2012 6:17 pm

Dang I was hoping the IPs were gone after seeing solid poop.
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby puffykid on Tue May 29, 2012 2:11 am

I agree with the above, its always a good idea to treat for a longer period of time to be safe rather than sorry. Especially since if you don't kill all the parasites in 1 sitting they could become drug resistant.
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby Terrance on Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:56 pm

Its been 1 weeks since I started treatment. Raw shrimp is best for soaking up Prazipro, so it was the only food source I fed so far. For the past week, he been taking 2 bites off the shrimp every night. I've also dosed the water to help the process. I'm going to do keep medicating for another week. I want this to be the last time I ever medicate him.
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby Pufferpunk on Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:25 am

You're really wasting meds & $$$ dosing the water, as FW fish don't drink water.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...

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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby Arny on Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:28 am

Pufferpunk wrote:You're really wasting meds & $$$ dosing the water, as FW fish don't drink water.

Would they not absorb the meds through their skin?
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby Pufferpunk on Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:35 am

Nope, unless the parasites are on the skin.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...

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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby Terrance on Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:22 am

Pufferpunk wrote:You're really wasting meds & $$$ dosing the water, as FW fish don't drink water.


Does that apply to all FW species? I have read on other forums about people dosing water and found worms coming out of the fish's body the following day.
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby LilGreenPuffer on Tue Jun 12, 2012 3:15 am

I personally think that dosing the water helps, since there are parasites in the water that you've got to kill too. And I did successfully deworm a couple fish by dosing water when I couldn't get the meds into them. I prefer treating both food and water.
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby bertie 83 on Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:55 am

I think the gills would pick up a little medication, just probably not enough to effectively get fully into the fishes system, internal parasites feed on whatever is in the fishes gut so that's the best way to rid your fish of them. Have you tried injecting any food with medication? Garlic added to the food durin thawing would also help massively
It's amazing how easy maintenance is. If done regularly and thoroughly
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby RTR on Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:10 am

Intestinal parasites are in the gut, not in the body. The gut is topographically not in the body. Food take in by the mouth must be digested and absorded through the gut walls to be used by the fish. IPs are not living in the water, they are in waste or in the guts of the fish. To be transmitted either the fish housing them must be eaten or the waste containing the young parasites must be eaten (common in tanks).

PP is correct, FW fish do not drink water. They must constantly excrete excess water absorbed through the skin and gills. Marcomolecules in the water and intestinal parasites are not absorbed or infected into the gut via the skin - that would be impossible. They can only get in through the mouth (or rarely the anus). It is a major difference between FW and SW fish.

FW fish rarely drink at all due their constant absorption of water. SW fish must drink a lot to compensate for water they lose through their skin to the salt water surrounding them. It sounds paradoxical, but it is sound science. The blood and body fluids of FW fish are hypertonic to the surrounding FW. So the absorb water passively via the skin. SW fish are hypotonic to the surrounding water, so they lose body water to the surrounding SW constantly. Their kidneys are highly effective at retaining needed minerals and excreting excess water and unneeded minerals.

Fish skins are water repellent, not waterproof. There is a huge difference in those two meanings.

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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby Arny on Tue Jun 12, 2012 4:42 pm

RTR wrote:Intestinal parasites are in the gut, not in the body. The gut is topographically not in the body. Food take in by the mouth must be digested and absorded through the gut walls to be used by the fish. IPs are not living in the water, they are in waste or in the guts of the fish. To be transmitted either the fish housing them must be eaten or the waste containing the young parasites must be eaten (common in tanks).

PP is correct, FW fish do not drink water. They must constantly excrete excess water absorbed through the skin and gills. Marcomolecules in the water and intestinal parasites are not absorbed or infected into the gut via the skin - that would be impossible. They can only get in through the mouth (or rarely the anus). It is a major difference between FW and SW fish.

FW fish rarely drink at all due their constant absorption of water. SW fish must drink a lot to compensate for water they lose through their skin to the salt water surrounding them. It sounds paradoxical, but it is sound science. The blood and body fluids of FW fish are hypertonic to the surrounding FW. So the absorb water passively via the skim. SW fish are hypotonic to the surrounding water, so they lose body water to the surrounding SW constantly. Their kidneys are highly effective at retaining needed minerals and excreting excess water and unneeded minerals.

Fish skins are water repellent, not waterproof. There is a huge difference in those two meanings.

HTH

Thanks for the info RTR :)
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby LilGreenPuffer on Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:48 pm

IPs are not living in the water, they are in waste or in the guts of the fish.

But then how do IPs spread through water?
"I will give you a talisman. Whenever you are in doubt, or when the self becomes too much with you, apply the following test. Recall the face of the poorest and the weakest man whom you may have seen, and ask yourself, if the step you contemplate is going to be of any use to him or her. Will she gain anything by it? Will it restore her to a control over her own life and destiny? In other words, will it lead to freedom for the hungry and spiritually starving millions? Then you will find your doubts and your self melt away."

Found among the papers of Mohatma Gandhi


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NEED NITRIFYING BACTERIA FOR YOUR NEW TANK? PM ME!
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Re: Slow Growth Rate for Fahaka

Postby Pufferpunk on Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:08 pm

The waste.
You are getting sleepy... you only hear the sound of my voice... you must do water changes... water changes... water changes... water changes...

"The solution to pollution is dilution!"
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